Across America, Latino Community Sighs With Relief

[Steve]

Generally speaking there is not "anti-immigration" policy here in the states. There is an anit-"illegal"-immigration policy here in the states, which is of course ignored by the pro-"illegal" vs. pro-"legal" immigration crowd.

I have to say that discrimination against muslims in this country is by far non-existent. The ground zero mosque was no different than when catholic nuns tried to built a convent near a nazi death camp in part to pray for the victims lost at the camp. There was anger about this and the pope told the nuns they needed to move their site. The attempt to build the mosque by a man with a shady background, shady funding and with their being a history of mosque building at the sight of "muslim victories" was causing concern, especially among the victims of muslim terrorists. As much as you want to deny the muslim part, they were muslims, not eco-terrorists, or swedish terrorists. At the same time, there have been no violent protests about the mosque, just discussion. There have been no attacks on muslims because of the mosque, just debate. If you look at the reaction of muslims around the world at percieved slights to their religion versus an actual attack by muslim terrorists that killed 3000 American and foriegn visitors to this country, there is no basis for claims of discrimination or bias against muslims. Let's be fair and think about the reality of the situation.

If you fail to staff and fund the division of homeland security that handles immigration, in a very passive/aggressive, bitchy way you have instituted an "anti-immigration" policy. I hate to say it, but in many ways my government has a lot in common with my mother in law. Just sayin'.

Reminds me of how I tell my son that by consistently failing to do his homework, he is intentionally striving to get poor grades. It's very predictable.

 

[Blade96]

Across America, Latino Community Sighs With Relief

by Daisy Hernandez NPR EXCERPT:
January 12, 2011

I wasn't the only person on Saturday who rushed to her Android when news came of the Tucson shooting. I wasn't looking however to read about what had happened. My auntie had already filled me in — "Someone tried to murder una representante. People have been killed," she'd reported. What I wanted to know was the killer's surname.

My eyes scanned the mobile papers. I held my breath. Finally, I saw it: Jared Loughner. Not a Ramirez, Gonzalez or Garcia.

Worst thing about it is that they have a reason for that sigh. Want proof? Look at this forum for petes sake. Someone it seems is always bitching about illegal immigrants. what do u think people who arent on this forum would say if he was a ramirez (not the ramirez on mt)

 

[billc]

First, what part of ILLEGAL immigration do you not see when we type it. If the citizens of mexico followed our laws and paid the fees to come here, they would be "golden." No problem. THe illegal part is a real hang up because they are cutting in line in front of people who acually are taking the time to come here legally. If they become citizens legally, they are Americans, no ifs ands or buts.


Elder 999, out of a country of over 300 million people, the examples of seething anti-islamic bigotry are:

"many"

some sihks are harrassed.

one man, a sihk, was murdered.

Some coptic egyptian were harrassed.

If you want some actual examples,

50 christians murdered when a bomb detonates outside their church in iraq
another bomb kills coptic christians in Egypt, coptic egyptians are being persecuted with no protection from the government.
over 3000 americans and foreign visitors are slaughtered
U.S.S. Cole is bombed
Kobar towers is bombed
2 embassies in africa are bombed
Mumbai is attacked, lots of people killed

This is a list I would expect if there was seething anti-islamic bigotry in AMerica.

How many people were murdered during the riots against "draw Mohammed day." The call to draw pictures of Mohammed killed more people than your entire list.

Americans, because of the past racial problems, know the difference between a non-terrorist muslim and the terrorists. the level of violence against muslims in this country is as I typed, virtually non-existant for a country of 300 million people who had well over 3000 citizens slaughtered by muslim terrorists.

Another example you might expect from a biggoted country, "Director Theo Van Gogh, shot and stabbed to death walking down the street because he made a film critical of the muslim treatment of muslim women.

Or, Non-muslim french women are putting on the muslim head covering to keep from being harrassed by muslim men, who hurl vulgar names at them and threaten them because they are not wearing head coverings.

Or, western peace activists women are being raped and forced into marrying muslim men and then held against their will. (I think that was your post Big Don, Thanks)

This is the kind of evidence I would like to see of the seething anti-muslim bigotry in the United States. You won't find it. Even with the mosque at ground zero, NO RIOTS, NO MURDER, NO BOMBING JUST DISCUSSION AND DEBATE. Try building a catholic church in any muslim dictatorship and see if the same would be said. America is one of the most tolerant countries in the world and does not deserve the attacks it recieves.
Thanks Elder 999, nice to talk to you again.

 

[elder999]

Elder 999, out of a country of over 300 million people, the examples of seething anti-islamic bigotry are:
.

Quite a bit more than:

I have to say that discrimination against muslims in this country is by far non-existent.

[yt]G2y8Sx4B2Sk[/yt]

:lfao:

 

[billc]

Oh, did that guy actually burn the Korans, no. Also, Michelle Malkin reports that 800 people were injured, and 130 killed over "Draw mohammed day." And the woman who set up the day had to disapear for fear of her life. Also, Three people were murdered when they tried to show winnie the pooh, over the character piglet.

Or, you could show how homosexuals are stoned to death, or female rape victims are punished as adulteresses.

the various news services had to censor the images of the dancing in the street that commenced on word that 3000 americans had died.

America is an amazing country. Anywhere else, and after 9/11 there would have been riots and murder. Here, we debate and discuss. I love this country.

 

[James Kovacich]

I don't have much of an opinion on this thread one way or the other. I think it's making a mountain out of a molehill.

But if this is a serious question, I have a couple of employees who are Puerto Rican and this topic actually came up. According to them, there is a strict definition of Latino/Latina and then a common use definition. Strictly speaking, latino refers to someone from a Latin American country. Technically, then everyone from South America, the Caribbean, Central America and Mexico would be latino. Spaniards, Italians, etc are not.

Commonly, though, according to these guys, in a broader sense, it's typically limited to spanish speaking people from latin america, which would exclude Brazilians and most of the Caribbean.

Correct, people with roots to Latin America are both latino/a and hispanic while Spaniards are only hispanic.

 

[Carol]

Correct, people with roots to Latin America are both latino/a and hispanic while Spaniards are only hispanic.

Just a bit of trivia -- the Federal govt. has migrated to using "Hispanic or Latino" as an EEO descriptor instead of just one or the other.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

I don't have much of an opinion on this thread one way or the other. I think it's making a mountain out of a molehill.

But if this is a serious question, I have a couple of employees who are Puerto Rican and this topic actually came up. According to them, there is a strict definition of Latino/Latina and then a common use definition. Strictly speaking, latino refers to someone from a Latin American country. Technically, then everyone from South America, the Caribbean, Central America and Mexico would be latino. Spaniards, Italians, etc are not.

Commonly, though, according to these guys, in a broader sense, it's typically limited to spanish speaking people from latin america, which would exclude Brazilians and most of the Caribbean.

I know there is a common usage versus a technical usage. I just think that it's funny in some respects, devisive in another, and down-right idiotic in another.

For instance, I don't like being called an African-American. I think it's merely an attempt by various portions of the population to show me as being "different" then others, and different people do it for different reasons.

When I was younger, I actually say a guy with a Mexican guy with a shirt that said something along the lines of Hispanics are from Spain, Latinos are from Europe, I am a Mexican.

Correct, people with roots to Latin America are both latino/a and hispanic while Spaniards are only hispanic.

But people in "Latin American" countries (ethnic natives, that is) have nothing to do with Spain or "Latin" countries. It is an importation from ~400 years ago. Both the terms Hispanic and Latin have to do with European natinos, not South American ones.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

Do we specify which state of Mexico Mexican Americans come from? No.

Yea, but South Africa is an actual country, not a State in Africa. So he would actually be correct in saying South African - American. Just like Guatemalen - American.

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

"Thank God this lunatic wasn't one of us, we might all be collectively blamed."

"BIGOTRY!"

WTF? The actions of people posting in this very thread holding all Muslims responsible for the actions of some of them during the "Ground Zero Mosque" controversy demonstrates that this woman was absolutely justified in her worry. You ought to be ashamed of yourselves. Do I really need to start digging up posts and shoving your hypocrisy in your faces?

But if we also follow your line of reasoning, then just because their may be some minority of individuals who will cause crimes against Hispanics for this, or because some minority of individuals may "blame" Hispanics as a whole for this incident, does not justify stereotyping the response of over 300 Million American.

Therefore her reaction would be just as bad as those you are decrying for blaming Muslims.

Worst thing about it is that they have a reason for that sigh. Want proof? Look at this forum for petes sake. Someone it seems is always bitching about illegal immigrants. what do u think people who arent on this forum would say if he was a ramirez (not the ramirez on mt)

Nothing, if he was a legal citizen of this country. Although you might hear something if he was the child of illegal immigrants, ie. an anchor baby.

 

[Steve]

I know there is a common usage versus a technical usage. I just think that it's funny in some respects, devisive in another, and down-right idiotic in another.

For instance, I don't like being called an African-American. I think it's merely an attempt by various portions of the population to show me as being "different" then others, and different people do it for different reasons.

When I was younger, I actually say a guy with a Mexican guy with a shirt that said something along the lines of Hispanics are from Spain, Latinos are from Europe, I am a Mexican.



But people in "Latin American" countries (ethnic natives, that is) have nothing to do with Spain or "Latin" countries. It is an importation from ~400 years ago. Both the terms Hispanic and Latin have to do with European natinos, not South American ones.

What the heck are you talking about? It wouldn't be so ridiculous if we didn't have little italy in so many cities, it irish pubs. I actually saw a white dude wear a tsgirt that said, "kiss me, i'm irish." Can you believe that guy? He didn't even have a good fake leprachaun accent.

You act like its only the latinos who are proud of theirgenetic heritage. Im guilty of being proud of my norwegian heritage. My two year old goes head first into.everything and I've said jokingly that she's a little biking in training. I didn't realize I was breaking an unwritten rule.

 

[Ken Morgan]

Sorry but regardless of their skin colour, their religion, their ancestry and provided they are a citizen of your country….aren’t they…just Americans?

 

[Big Don]

Sorry but regardless of their skin colour, their religion, their ancestry and provided they are a citizen of your country….aren’t they…just Americans?

Ideally, that is true. But, the thing is, lots of people are more interested in being "special" than in being American.

We can have no '50-50' allegiance in this country. Either a man is an American and nothing else, or he is not an American at all.

Theodore Roosevelt

 

[Steve]

Sorry but regardless of their skin colour, their religion, their ancestry and provided they are a citizen of your country….aren’t they…just Americans?

Regardless of akin color, very few people in america are just american. That was my point. The double standard os that white people don't think that when they put a swedish flag on their car that it counts.

 

[Big Don]

Regardless of akin color, very few people in america are just american. That was my point. The double standard os that white people don't think that when they put a swedish flag on their car that it counts.

Yeah, because white people aren't allowed to be proud of their heritage without that notorious little four letter "N" word coming out...

 

[5-0 Kenpo]

What the heck are you talking about? It wouldn't be so ridiculous if we didn't have little italy in so many cities, it irish pubs. I actually saw a white dude wear a tsgirt that said, "kiss me, i'm irish." Can you believe that guy? He didn't even have a good fake leprachaun accent.

You act like its only the latinos who are proud of theirgenetic heritage. Im guilty of being proud of my norwegian heritage. My two year old goes head first into.everything and I've said jokingly that she's a little biking in training. I didn't realize I was breaking an unwritten rule.

Uh, not sure what you're ranting about here.

I was simply saying that there are those Mexicans who don't like being called Hispanic or Latino as they are European concepts which are unrelated, except through colonization, their heritage, and gave an example of such from my past experience. He has more then his right to celebrate his heritage. In fact, as a Black man, I would say that I wish that I could point to my place of historical origin and understand it's culture

I was also giving you my reasoning for not liking being labeled as African-American. I never said that people shouldn't celebrate their heritage.

Regardless of akin color, very few people in america are just american. That was my point. The double standard os that white people don't think that when they put a swedish flag on their car that it counts.

And I wouldn't care for that either.

However, to me the tipping point is whether this person uses their ethnic heritage to separate themselves from the rest of the population, or as a simple recognition and pride over it.

I know black and hispanic people who use such terms because they are deliberatly trying to separate themselves from people not of their background. That's why I don't like it.

 

[granfire]

A little fatal flaw in the 'Mexican vs. Latino' debate:

A lot of you 'Mexicans' are not from our neighbor south of the boarder, but from any of the central american countries.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Do we specify which state of Mexico Mexican Americans come from? No.

I was refering to an entire country. To go by your logic, Mexican Americans would then be North American Americans. Does mixing Continents, States, countries, counties, and city states all together to make some lame point make any sense at all?... NO!
Sean

 

[Empty Hands]

I was refering to an entire country. To go by your logic, Mexican Americans would then be North American Americans. Does mixing Continents, States, countries, counties, and city states all together to make some lame point make any sense at all?... NO!
Sean

It does when "Africa" becomes one big homogenous, miserable "over there" place, full of malaria and AK47 wielding natives. It's pretty common to do so, many are guilty of it and not all the guilty share a common viewpoint or politics. Never mind that there is almost no cultural similarity between say Egypt and Mozambique, it's all "Africa."

 

[Touch Of Death]

It does when "Africa" becomes one big homogenous, miserable "over there" place, full of malaria and AK47 wielding natives. It's pretty common to do so, many are guilty of it and not all the guilty share a common viewpoint or politics. Never mind that there is almost no cultural similarity between say Egypt and Mozambique, it's all "Africa."

View points aside, to take someone of obvious European descent, and try to pass them of as simply African instead of South African, is kind of insulting. And, by that I mean insulting to African Americans that know damn well that kid's family originally came from Europe. If you want to play this ridiculous game, go right ahead, but its asinine.
Sean