Thinking about distance

[FearlessFreep]

One thing I've been thinking about this week has to do with distance in evasion.

Assuming a normal fighting stance, and my opponent throws a kicking attack.

If I evade to the rear..slide step...then I really don't have to move far. Maybe about six inches will make their roundhouse, for example, miss, and still have me close enough to throw a counter-strike. I think lateral movements require you to go more distance to clear the attacking foot, which leaves you needing to cover more ground to counter strike. On the other hand, moving laterally completely changes the angles and I think can throw your opponent off.

Maybe an example: From open stance, my opponent throws a rear-leg roundhouse-

1) Slide step back a short-distance (6 inches) and immediatley come back with a front side hop-to roundhouse as their foot is coming down.
Advantage: short distance and fast response to catch them before they've set and can prepare the next move.
Disadvantage: short distance means that if they are doing a quick step-in to close some distance before throwing the attack, you could find yourself not really getting back far enough and being right in the attack. Also, linear back and forth motion seems fairly common and they may be expecting a straight on counter strike.

2) Slide step 90 degrees to side (away from kick) and counter-strike with a rear-leg side-kick straight to the body
Advantage: comes from unexpected angle. Side-kick could set them off balance for easier follow ups.
Disadvantage: slower. Need to slide further out to avoid kick and rear-leg side-kick takes longer to launch
Note: you could also roundhouse into the ribs from that position, I think. Not sure of the relative adv/disadv

3) Slide step 45 degrees forward and punch or double punch
Advantage: Probabably a real surprise to come in at an off angle. Double punch could push opponent back for follow up
Disadvantage: If you are close enough to punch, close enough to be punched Probably requires longest slide.

I can think of others (such as backward 45 degree slides and various attacks from those positions) but the general thought is that for optimum counter-strike, different directions require different distance

No real point or question, just some random thoughts...mostly trying to organize my own...

 

[Zepp]

Sounds like a good analysis to me.

My thoughts on number 2: You need to keep in mind when you do this that you effectively changing your stance. There will be a short moment when you are exposed. The advantage of throwing a roundhouse in this case, instead of a sidekick, is that you will get the kick out faster, and thus leave yourself exposed for a shorter amount of time. You could possibly throw this kick to the head as well.

 

[FearlessFreep]

The advantage of throwing a roundhouse in this case, instead of a sidekick, is that you will get the kick out faster, and thus leave yourself exposed for a shorter amount of time.

Good point. I actually practice both. Mostly I'm thinking that the arm angle that the opponent will more likely have their arms in a position that the roundhouse will hit the arms but the center shot of a sidekick (or frontkick?) will have a more open target

You could possibly throw this kick to the head as well.

Hmm..good point. I don't think like this yet as we are still learning a lot and even the adults are not using head gear and taking headshots yet. Still..good to keep in mind.

Thanks

 

[TX_BB]

1) It's OK startegy but people will figure it out and should be able to nail by adjusting their roundhouse. Try a full back step with an immediate rear leg roundhouse.
2) Good fighters should be able to adjust quickly to this technique. Reason is they are watching you through the technique. I personally would turn my technique to a short turn step back kick, most kids will automatically change it to short turn step turn kick(roundhouse).
3) You need to assume the other person won't use their cross punch or to a convert their roundhouse hook kick.

Freep your working hard to improve tactics. You may want to put your energy towards getting your techniques so that freely flow when the opportunities come to you. Keep workiing hard

 

[FearlessFreep]

Good points. Keep in mind that mostly I was just thinking in terms of how movement in different directions would allow for different types of counter-strike, but mostly that they require differnet distances (which in turn allows or restricts the counter-strike) One reason I ask all these questions though, and yes, I talk with my sabomnim about all the same stuff, perhaps even more, is because I realize there are 'good' tactics and 'bad tactics you can get away with against inexperienced opponents' and I don't want to get stuck in the position of relying on that second category


Freep your working hard to improve tactics. You may want to put your energy towards getting your techniques so that freely flow when the opportunities come to you. Keep workiing hard

Thanks! I'm actually usually thinking in terms of three time frames; near term, mid term, long term. "What can I do *now*, knowing the techniques I know and how weel I can execute them", "What could I do soon if I put the work into the movements and technique", "What would I like to do eventually, when I get more skill and ability" My questions and comments tend to come from all three time frames of thought. Or rather, I think of things, ask questions, and then put it into the time frame when I think I will be able to apply it.


Going into a class/session. I usually try to have one or two things to work on. Sometimes something new, sometimes a refinement of something I've been working on the last few sessions. I tend to start thinking a few days ahead of time (actually, I tend to really start thinking right after class in terms of desired result, based on how the class went, but I don't start thinking of actual techinque/movement, until maybe a few days before class) and will start working on whatever footwork/movement/improved execution/etc... I think I will need Basically, I start practicing a few days ahead on whatever I want to focus on in my next sparring opportunity. I try to keep it to one or two, not 47 Sometimes I find "hey, that worked well", sometimes it's "good concept but needs more practice over the next few days/weeks" and sometimes it's "Ok idea, but you're not ready for it" For example, tonight is sparring night. I still want to continue developing the lateral evasion/counter-strike approaches I've been working on for several weeks, but I want to bring in the defensive first strike approach I mentioned in the other thread. Yesterday and last night especially, I really did a lot of focus on my front-side hop-to front kicks and side kicks to get ready. Just, like you said, to get the techniques to flow well.

 

[Miles]

Jay,

It is good you are thinking about these things at this stage in your training-will put you ahead of the curve in the long run. But I do agree that you can overthink strategy and tactics early on-just don't get frustrated. I suggest you keep a training log to keep track of what you worked on, what you need to work on, and what you don't need to work on as much.

Miles

 

[FearlessFreep]

It is good you are thinking about these things at this stage in your training-will put you ahead of the curve in the long run. But I do agree that you can overthink strategy and tactics early on-just don't get frustrated.

He he, good point. I actually mentioned that to my Sabomnim tonight that I have more days to think they to spar so I can really out think myself some days As a matter of fact, my first few sparring experiences I kept thinking about "OK, we're in a closed stance so I can throw this feint and then this attack or if he comes with that attack I'll do this to counter or if he...wait he just switched stance...ok, from *here* I can...ooff..he just kicked me...ok start over...." and I really had to throttle back how much I thought about at one time until I get much more intuitive and second-nature in more of what I do

I suggest you keep a training log to keep track of what you worked on, what you need to work on, and what you don't need to work on as much.

That's what I post here! j/k Good idea

Tonight, my sabomnim reminded me that I need to relax and get more of a feel for the ebb and flow, the dynamics. I'm still too jittery and constantly in motion, whether attacking, evading or just generally pinging around. He said I'm too much like a one year old labrador He said this will help my balance and increase the energy when I *do* engage

 

[Flamebearer]

Good work, thinking about the attacks, counters, etc. Have you tried them out in one-, two-, and three-step exercises?

Caution: It's easy to plan what you're going to do, but you can never plan a sparring match - it's a very fluid (changing) situation. So if you're going to work on these counters, practice them until you can apply them without thinking.

Also besides stepping in at a 45 angle, you can step back at 45, creating both side and back distance (or if you think on a mathematical graph, distance on both the x and y axes) and kick. What always gets one of my classmates is a low-high roundhouse.:ultracool *Hee hee*

Just my thoughts.
-Flamebearer