The Use Of Pepper Spray as SD?

[Transk53]

No particular situation has compelled me ask this, but just a chat with a colleague. It happened because I had to deal with an abusive female at work, none of the verbals was directed towards myself, just another female. Now as I know all too well what the UK law side of things is not even worth exploring, and this is just hypothetical as a situation. Even in the day job, we have to be always conscious of the fact that any allegation could be costly for us. We would still face the suspension of our licence until investigated.

We have reasoned that if it was possible to carry Pepper spray, we would be able to at least convey some perceived authority over the female. IE, the chance of kicking off would be diminished if you are going to get face full of Pepper spray. Now we are not coppers obviously, but my colleague and I are curious as to whether this approach is adopted to use the good old CYA (cover your ###e). I don’t just mean randomly spraying females, but if you had a situation that has escalated up to being verbal and threats are starting to materialise, would you spray rather than try to restrain. More to the point, would it be legal too?

The thought here is that with a male, you are less likely to get an assault charge, or at least alleged. With a female, so many allegations can be made. So in this context, would that be a defence if it got that far. Could you reason to the authorities that you sprayed because you were trying to protect yourself, and the female from injury for example? When my colleague and I were discussing this, it seems like a common sense approach. This is of course being a situation where the female is static, but using threatening language giving cause to believe that the copper is likely facing a tangible threat.

 

[Zero]

I don’t just mean randomly spraying females,

Thanks for the clarification, randomly spraying females, while once in vogue, will only lead to a world of troubles these days (and well it should)

 

[Transk53]

Thanks for the clarification, randomly spraying females, while once in vogue, will only lead to a world of troubles these days (and well it should)

You have had to use Pepper spray. How did you justify it?, well if you can on this forum.

 

[Zero]

The thought here is that with a male, you are less likely to get an assault charge, or at least alleged. With a female, so many allegations can be made.

On a more serious note and not meaning to de-rail but, I wonder... These days plenty of guys seem just as litigious and willing to run to the cops with assault claims as females. You even get the guys that do a bit of a monkey dance shuffle, you pop them one and then they cry assault and battery or start dialling the cops. Makes me sick. It all went south when we started to have to think through the repercussions of simply cracking some low life across the jaw.
I'm just back from training, fully loaded on supplements but on re-reading the above seems perfectly fine.

 

[Tez3]

Putting aside any legalities here, the police in the UK rarely use pepper spray for a number of reasons. It carries a number of implications, it has to be sprayed directly into the face otherwise you risk yourself and any colleagues also being affected. Someone sprayed will usually fall to their knees, this could be dangerous depending on where you are ie top of stairs etc. It's often more trouble than is worth it.
Now to a legality, if you believe you are in fear of your life, that you are about to be struck then you are allowed under our laws to make a pre-emptive strike, this has to be 'reasonable', pepper spraying someone is not reasonable, you will have deemed to have the canister in your hand ready to use so it will not be a defensive move to spray them, they could say you looked as if you were going to spray/attack them and their move was defensive. So you are no further forward. Spraying will be seen as an assault which could have been avoided if you had restrained them instead. Most police officers here prefer to restrain because using pepper spray is not as useful, unless an officer is on their own when it may be preferable to spray but you may still have to restrain.
You would have to have the co-operation of your employers and also have them supply pepper spray too but I can't see any defence you can make if you use it just because someone is getting leery. A multiple attack on you when you are on your own then probably you can justify the use but questions would be asked why you were carrying it.

I would make sure that if possible you are within the purview of a cctv camera, that you worked in pairs and you trained well in your restraint techniques. Also make sure you employer is up on his duty of care responsibilities to their employees, that includes your safety and well being.

 

[Transk53]

On a more serious note and not meaning to de-rail but, I wonder... These days plenty of guys seem just as litigious and willing to run to the cops with assault claims as females. You even get the guys that do a bit of a monkey dance shuffle, you pop them one and then they cry assault and battery or start dialling the cops. Makes me sick. It all went south when we started to have to think through the repercussions of simply cracking some low life across the jaw.
I'm just back from training, fully loaded on supplements but on re-reading the above seems perfectly fine.

No worries, yeah I did see the innuendo lol. Only one copper I know has had to use it in a situation, the others have not done as far as I know. We were just curious if it any any different in other countries than the UK.

Makes me sick. It all went south when we started to have to think through the repercussions of simply cracking some low life across the jaw.

Yep, me too.

 

[Zero]

No worries, yeah I did see the innuendo lol. Only one copper I know has had to use it in a situation, the others have not done as far as I know. We were just curious if it any any different in other countries than the UK.



Yep, me too.

Glad you picked up the innuendo, was worried for a second you'd actually taken that to mean there was a time I went around pepper spraying broad's in the face.

 

[Transk53]

You would have to have the co-operation of your employers and also have them supply pepper spray too but I can't see any defence you can make if you use it just because someone is getting leery. A multiple attack on you when you are on your own then probably you can justify the use but questions would be asked why you were carrying it.

Not matter which way, one is still cynical. Better off throwing daffodils.

 

[Tez3]

Not matter which way, one is still cynical. Better off throwing daffodils.

Very good distraction technique! The attackers would wonder what the hell you were doing and pause just long enough for you to do whatever.....:uhoh:

 

[ballen0351]

Biggest thing about pepper spray to remember is have a plan B because it doesn't work on everyone. You can spray me and it won't bother me that much other then to make me mad. I've been sprayed more times then I can count. I've sprayed people and had them laugh at me. A coworker sprays it on crackers and eats it. So if you use it be ready to do something else.

 

[Instructor]

I used pepper spray on a female. Yup... She was crazed, pissed off, and swinging a metal pipe at me like a baseball bat. Upside.. the pepper spray reduced her to a snivelling mess on the ground, end of problem. Downside... puff of wind carried it into my eyes too and that crap burns.

 

[Transk53]

Thanks peeps, some interesting replies there

 

[Transk53]

Very good distraction technique! The attackers would wonder what the hell you were doing and pause just long enough for you to do whatever.....:uhoh:

Yeah suppose I could have shot them out of a 17pdr.