The Cycle of Civilization

[Blotan Hunka]

I just came across this quotation:

The Cycle of Civilization
Man begins his existence in bondage, and rises:
from bondage through spiritual faith,
from spiritual faith to courage,
from courage to liberty,
from liberty to abundance,
from abundance to selfishness,
from selfishness to complacency,
from complacency to apathy,
from apathy to dependency,
from dependency back into bondage.

-Clarence Manion, dean of Nortre Dame law school (1941-1952) as quoted in "In whom do you trust?", R.B. Thieme, Jr.

What stage are you in?

 

[Sukerkin]

Well, in general terms, most of the prominent Western world is in the last stage . On second thoughts, that's far too close to the truth to be funny .

The cycle doesn't really work when applied to individuals (somewhat like the fictional 'psycohistory' posited by Asimov). For myself, I don't fit on the list at all ... we need to add a line that says something like "Enlightened despondency" i.e. you see what is wrong but are powerless to do anything about it.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I just came across this quotation:

The Cycle of Civilization
Man begins his existence in bondage, and rises:
from bondage through spiritual faith,
from spiritual faith to courage,
from courage to liberty,
from liberty to abundance,
from abundance to selfishness,
from selfishness to complacency,
from complacency to apathy,
from apathy to dependency,
from dependency back into bondage.

-Clarence Manion, dean of Nortre Dame law school (1941-1952) as quoted in "In whom do you trust?", R.B. Thieme, Jr.

What stage are you in?

Who said everyone begins in bondage again? how so?
sean

 

[Rich Parsons]

I just came across this quotation:

The Cycle of Civilization
Man begins his existence in bondage, and rises:
from bondage through spiritual faith,
from spiritual faith to courage,
from courage to liberty,
from liberty to abundance,
from abundance to selfishness,
from selfishness to complacency,
from complacency to apathy,
from apathy to dependency,
from dependency back into bondage.

-Clarence Manion, dean of Nortre Dame law school (1941-1952) as quoted in "In whom do you trust?", R.B. Thieme, Jr.

What stage are you in?

Who said everyone begins in bondage again? how so?
sean

While I think the quote was meant to motivate people and with the rest of the speech I assume went with it I could see it do such.

As to an arguement of logic and where I am in the system, I have my opinion, but here is how some might see me:

As an American by those in other countries not so well off they might see me in any of the following: abundance to selfishness to complacency to apathy.

From someone from a few hundred years ago they might think I am dependant upon technology.

As I have a personal issue with the arguement of Spiritual faith being required to have courage to get liberty, I would hope that I would not bee seen in the spiritual faith section.

I gues it depends upon those doing measuring.

 

[FearlessFreep]

This cycle is often said to represent the progress of Democratic societies and is also often attributed to Alexander Tyler from early US days

 

[Bigshadow]

I believe the state of the union is in the apathy to dependency stage. I read this back in the late 90s. It seemed to me then to be in the complacency to apathy stage.

 

[wade]

So Blotan, which arm of our military forces did you serve in?

 

[Blotan Hunka]

USArmy

 

[Blotan Hunka]

As I have a personal issue with the arguement of Spiritual faith being required to have courage to get liberty, I would hope that I would not bee seen in the spiritual faith section.

I gues it depends upon those doing measuring.

Well, I guess it could be asked, name a civilization that didnt have some sort of religious base at its start.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Well, I guess it could be asked, name a civilization that didnt have some sort of religious base at its start.

That is not my point.

To escape religious persecution does not require one to have to have religious faith.

To fight for ones life, does not require one to have a religious faith.

The logical arguement is not valid. It makes a jump that has no proof, or proof that I have seen presented. It makes a statement as if it is fact.


And with your initial question of "What stare are you in?" I assumed you were asking on a personal individual level and not asking "What stage do I believe my culture or country or civilization is in?"

 

[MA-Caver]

Who said everyone begins in bondage again? how so?
sean

I was wondering the same thing...

 

[Bigshadow]

In the OP I believe man represents the people of a particular civilization.

 

[jazkiljok]

I just came across this quotation:

The Cycle of Civilization

What stage are you in?

me? i'm with snagglepuss...:ubercool:

 

[hardheadjarhead]

The Cycle of Civilization
Man begins his existence in bondage, and rises:
from bondage through spiritual faith,
from spiritual faith to courage,
from courage to liberty,
from liberty to abundance,
from abundance to selfishness,
from selfishness to complacency,
from complacency to apathy,
from apathy to dependency,
from dependency back into bondage.

Well, I guess it could be asked, name a civilization that didnt have some sort of religious base at its start.

While that might be an apt observation, one might be able to think of a number of civilizations where spiritual faith didn't necessarily precede courage, or liberty, or abundance. As pithy as this quote by Manion is, the chronology he provides doesn't quite ring true.

Curmudgeons of every generation could look at this and nod their heads, pointing to the decline of their own civilization. I suspect Manion was doing this half a century ago (when, I assume, he wrote it). Written fifty years before that, I don't doubt someone else would have found an available audience for it.

We are, I suppose, in an era of opulence like no other. On the other hand, when I was in high school thirty-five years ago we were in an era of opulence like no other. When my sisters were in high school, we were also in an era of opulence like no other...and by God, how people moaned that we were in decline. Now many look to those days and preface them with "good ol'."

Life ain't what it used to be, but then it never was.


Regards,

Steve

 

[wade]

Hey, HHJH, who with, when and where?