Switching from ITA to WTF...Painless???

[Atomic22]

So.... I'm kind of in a unique situation (for reasons too countless to completely describe in this post).

I did ITA style Taekwondo officially for 7 years (but been practicing at home for another 5 years=12 yrs total--my father is a certified instructor). My ultimate dream right now is to get in the US National Collegiate team and compete in the Olympics (2016 or maybe 2012 if I'm lucky) and I wanted to know if switching will be a difficult process. Is there some sort of accelerated belt promotion process in the WTF for experienced TKDers or will I have to start over?

 

[terryl965]

So.... I'm kind of in a unique situation (for reasons too countless to completely describe in this post).

I did ITA style Taekwondo officially for 7 years (but been practicing at home for another 5 years=12 yrs total--my father is a certified instructor). My ultimate dream right now is to get in the US National Collegiate team and compete in the Olympics (2016 or maybe 2012 if I'm lucky) and I wanted to know if switching will be a difficult process. Is there some sort of accelerated belt promotion process in the WTF for experienced TKDers or will I have to start over?

There is no WTF belt ststem, there is the Kukkiwon in Soul Korea that certifies BB for International and Olympic TKD. The problem comes from you really how fast and willing are you to change everything you have learned in those 12 years? Are you really willing to devote enough time to get there and finally can you find the right instructor for you> Where are you located and maybe the board can help you find the right school.

 

[Atomic22]

I am more than willing to adapt to a new environment. I don't consider myself solely a TKD martial artist; I learn, practice, and mix many different martial arts without any problems whatsoever. For the past 4 months all I've been doing is working on my sparring techniques. I honestly think I've got what takes raw talent-wise and going to the Olympics is my DREAM so I have the devotion.

I'm going to university in fall 2008 (most likely in the NE: New York or Massachusetts ) and its probable, judging from my recent interviews, that I'll attend an ivy-league or similar caliber school. Right now I live in France because my father is an ex-pat, so I haven't been sparring with anyone other than him for the past 4 years. Back in the day when I used to be in the ITA formally, I won a few 1st place sparring trophies at national tournaments.

What should I do to make this dream a reality? I don't want to spend 4 years to reattain a BB (but if I must I'll do it). Should I start by learning the the WTF korean terminology (which is more in depth than ITA) and the different poomse?

BTW thanks for the really quick response.

 

[wade]

IF! you have a legitimate Black Belt certificate from a legitimate Master the USAT should accept it and you can compete as a Black Belt. You do not have to start over.

If all you have sparred with in the last few years is your dad then you are starting late. The players today are young, fast and hot. You want to play? Leave home and start playing. Now!

 

[mango.man]

I think you need to first understand how Olympic TKD works. For instance, do you realize that each country, other than the host nation, can only send a maximum of 4 players to The Olympics? The host nation can send 8.

Then you need to understand the whole qualification process. Qualifying the weight division and then qualifying yourself for that weight division. It is incredibly complex and convoluted. It is nothing like just going in and beating someone and making the US Olympic Team.

You do have a pretty cool opportunity coming though in the next couple of months, if you are available to escape France and travel to the USA.

On April 5th, in Des Moines, Iowa 3 out of 4 of the US Olympic team members will be chosen. The 4th is Steven Lopez who secured his spot on the team a few months ago in Manchester, England. The other 3 "Top Seeds" for the USA are Steven's brother Mark, His sister Diana and Charlotte Craig. All 3 failed to qualify their divisions in Manchester after qualifying themselves a few months prior. Then in December those 3 were able to qualfy the weight divisions in their last opportunity in Cali Columbia. If they hadn't then the US would only be sending Steven Lopez to Beijing.

So since they qualifed the divisons again in Cali now they again need to qualify themselves.

This weekend in Colorado Springs at the Olympic Training Center was the fight-off to see who would be their opponents at the final fight off in Iowa.

On April 5th, Nia Abdallah will fight Diana Lopez for the Women's Featherweight spot. Nia was the 2004 USA Olympic Silver Medalist. Nia will need to win 2 fights against Diana to win the team spot while Diana, as the top seed, needs only beat Nia 1 time to go to the big show. This is expected to be a very exciting match as Nia lost this spot to Diana in the August team trials and everyone that was there agrees that Nia actually won their fight.

On April 5th, Chris Martinez will fight Mark Lopez for the Men's Featherweight spot. There are some saying the Chris may "Bow Out" to Mark. They both train at Elite TKD in Sugarland Tx and are trained by the elder Lopez, Jean who is also the USA Team Coach. Sending Steven, Diana and Mark to the Olympics for Team USA would be the first time that 3 siblings have competed at the same Olympics in the same sport since something like 1908. Should they fight it out, Chris would also need to defeat Mark 2 times where Mark only needs to win 1 to go to the big show.

On April 5th, Anees Hasnain will fight Charlotte Craig for the Female Flyweight spot. I have no idea who Anees is but Charlotte is someone that my daughter has fought a few time and we have seen her compete many more times. She is a lot of fun to watch. Some say that she only got her opportunity because Mandy Meloon was removed from the team after a serious mental breakdown. Charlotte has made the most of the opportunity though by captuing bronze medals at the 2006 Jr World Championships in Vietnam and following up in 2007 with a bronze at the Sr World Championships in Beijing. Again, Annes must beat Charlotte twice while Charlotte only needs to beat Anees 1 time to go to the big show.

So the bottom line is that on April 5th, in Des Moines Iowa, 3 out of the 4 US Olympic TKD Team spots will be secured. Also, just for good measure, on April 4th in Des Moines the 20 USA Jr Team Members to fight at the 2008 Jr World Championships in Turkey will be chosen from the results of a Round-Robin fight off based on those finishing in the top 4 at the recent Jr World Championships Open in Colorado Springs.

Finally, add in that April 5 and 6 in Des Moines is the 2nd of the 5 National Qualifiers for USAT Jr Olympics and Senior Nationals and you have yourself 1 hell of a weekend of sport TKD. Choosing the top seeds for Nationals, the 10 member Jr National Team and 3 of the 4 Olympic team spots.

If you are the least bit interested in Olympic TKD, I don't see how you can miss this event!!!!

If you can't be there, you can follow all the action at http://www.usa-taekwondo.us

 

[terryl965]

mango.man has brought up some great advise but my only problem would be your skill level against those that have been playing the game of tag. When I say this it is not to offend anybody but you have really never played with the elite of sport TKD, so why would yu start at the top. My suggetion is do some local smaller tournaments first to get your feet wet and then start to see if you can get the proper training for sport and actually learn all the rules and how to play the game. Sport TKD is like a average person who plays football at the park with friends ona Saturday afternoon and Elite sport TKD is like the professional football players they watch every Sunday. There is a world of difference between the average player and those elite athletes. Just my two cents here.

 

[Atomic22]

Do any of you know what the process is for going from the National Collegiate Taekwondo Association to the Olympics? Is competing in the NCTA the best way to get my foot in the door?

Also, there are only 4 people that qualify for each Olympic competition? I thought it was 4 from each weight class. More work to do then I guess


@wade- Thanks I guess I'll have to look for my certificate...I think its in storage somewhere. My master's school closed a while back, do you think this might have an effect on whether or not my rank is considered legitimate?

@wade+terryl965 I know my dad isn't the best sparring partner (not half bad though) in the world, but I've watched many...many matches and I think I have what it takes get through. When I was still taking formal instruction, I won a few national 1st place trophies in my weight class. When I was 11 years old I could beat my instructor 50% of the time in points match (He was really good...I think he got his Sr. 4th degree a while back) The things you see only the top few TKDers ever do in a real match, like a 720 triple kick, are things that I can pull off easily. I also try my best to stay in top form; I run a half-marathon distance every Sunday. I hope I didn't sound like I was showing off but I felt that I had to give you examples of what I can really do and that I really am motivated. I have until 2012 to get ready, and by then I'll "wet my feet" in quite a few tournys.

@mango.man- Those sound like amazing opportunities but I'm not planning to compete in 2008, 2012 is the next real chance I'll have. I'll be sure to watch it and see if Steven can defend his title! He has a big legacy to live up to.

 

[mango.man]

Do any of you know what the process is for going from the National Collegiate Taekwondo Association to the Olympics? Is competing in the NCTA the best way to get my foot in the door?

Also, there are only 4 people that qualify for each Olympic competition? I thought it was 4 from each weight class. More work to do then I guess .

Here is the selection crtieria for making the TKD US Olympic Team. http://www.usa-taekwondo.us/08SOGTKDMWATHamended20Nov.pdf This is for 2008 obviously, but the process will be similar for 2012, I imagine. I suggest you read it.

Also, yes, the number is 4. 2 Male and 2 Female. That is it except the host nation gets 4 male and 4 female.

I have until 2012 to get ready, and by then I'll "wet my feet" in quite a few tournys.

Take a look at the point system used, begining on P13 of the link above. As you will see when you read it, how you and others perform Nationally and Internationally in 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2012 will have a huge impact on making the team in 2012. You are not going to walk into a ring in 2012 and win 1 fight and make the team.

 

[FearlessFreep]

Keep in mind that switching 'arts' is one thing... switching sports and expecting to compete at the highest level of the sport is a *lot* different. Remember

"Rules determine strategy
Strategy determines tactics
Tactics determine technique
Techniques determining training"*

Olympic style sparring is *not* Taekwondo, it's a rule set for a competition that uses some Taekwondo techniques, if you will. But the scoring rules drive a certain set of techniques that are most effective in that particular context. At the elite level pretty much that is all you are doing. Which means that switching rule sets (point to wtf) is going to entail a change of rules and derived from that a change in training. Anyone may be great at "Taekwondo" in general, but that doesn't mean that changing to a particular niche sport version of the art and competing at that elite level against people, for whom that is all they do, is going to be easy.


Incidentally the issue about sparring against your dad has nothing to do with you or your dad... just that if you always spar the same small circle of people, you learn to spar against those people, which is why getting out into tournaments to face people who may be faster, slower, smarter, stringer,weaker, craftier, or just plain different, then your normal partners, is a good way to measure your skills.



*yeah, I made that up, or a variation of it, awhile ago....

 

[Laurentkd]

I think you need to first understand how Olympic TKD works. For instance, do you realize that each country, other than the host nation, can only send a maximum of 4 players to The Olympics? The host nation can send 8.

Then you need to understand the whole qualification process. Qualifying the weight division and then qualifying yourself for that weight division. It is incredibly complex and convoluted. It is nothing like just going in and beating someone and making the US Olympic Team.

You do have a pretty cool opportunity coming though in the next couple of months, if you are available to escape France and travel to the USA.

On April 5th, in Des Moines, Iowa 3 out of 4 of the US Olympic team members will be chosen. The 4th is Steven Lopez who secured his spot on the team a few months ago in Manchester, England. The other 3 "Top Seeds" for the USA are Steven's brother Mark, His sister Diana and Charlotte Craig. All 3 failed to qualify their divisions in Manchester after qualifying themselves a few months prior. Then in December those 3 were able to qualfy the weight divisions in their last opportunity in Cali Columbia. If they hadn't then the US would only be sending Steven Lopez to Beijing.

So since they qualifed the divisons again in Cali now they again need to qualify themselves.

This weekend in Colorado Springs at the Olympic Training Center was the fight-off to see who would be their opponents at the final fight off in Iowa.

On April 5th, Nia Abdallah will fight Diana Lopez for the Women's Featherweight spot. Nia was the 2004 USA Olympic Silver Medalist. Nia will need to win 2 fights against Diana to win the team spot while Diana, as the top seed, needs only beat Nia 1 time to go to the big show. This is expected to be a very exciting match as Nia lost this spot to Diana in the August team trials and everyone that was there agrees that Nia actually won their fight.

On April 5th, Chris Martinez will fight Mark Lopez for the Men's Featherweight spot. There are some saying the Chris may "Bow Out" to Mark. They both train at Elite TKD in Sugarland Tx and are trained by the elder Lopez, Jean who is also the USA Team Coach. Sending Steven, Diana and Mark to the Olympics for Team USA would be the first time that 3 siblings have competed at the same Olympics in the same sport since something like 1908. Should they fight it out, Chris would also need to defeat Mark 2 times where Mark only needs to win 1 to go to the big show.

On April 5th, Anees Hasnain will fight Charlotte Craig for the Female Flyweight spot. I have no idea who Anees is but Charlotte is someone that my daughter has fought a few time and we have seen her compete many more times. She is a lot of fun to watch. Some say that she only got her opportunity because Mandy Meloon was removed from the team after a serious mental breakdown. Charlotte has made the most of the opportunity though by captuing bronze medals at the 2006 Jr World Championships in Vietnam and following up in 2007 with a bronze at the Sr World Championships in Beijing. Again, Annes must beat Charlotte twice while Charlotte only needs to beat Anees 1 time to go to the big show.

So the bottom line is that on April 5th, in Des Moines Iowa, 3 out of the 4 US Olympic TKD Team spots will be secured. Also, just for good measure, on April 4th in Des Moines the 20 USA Jr Team Members to fight at the 2008 Jr World Championships in Turkey will be chosen from the results of a Round-Robin fight off based on those finishing in the top 4 at the recent Jr World Championships Open in Colorado Springs.

Finally, add in that April 5 and 6 in Des Moines is the 2nd of the 5 National Qualifiers for USAT Jr Olympics and Senior Nationals and you have yourself 1 hell of a weekend of sport TKD. Choosing the top seeds for Nationals, the 10 member Jr National Team and 3 of the 4 Olympic team spots.

If you are the least bit interested in Olympic TKD, I don't see how you can miss this event!!!!

If you can't be there, you can follow all the action at http://www.usa-taekwondo.us

I am not too far from Des Moines. Do you know exactly where this will be held? It would sure be fun to watch!

 

[mango.man]

I don't believe an exact location has been announced yet. My inclination is that the Convention Center is the most likely place.

Keep an eye on http://www.usa-taekwondo.us/318_960.htm and I would think it shouldn't be long before they make an official announcement.

 

[tkd1964]

It would take some intense training to even try to qualify for the Olympics. Being that you will be starting College and an Ivy League at that, I don't know how you would be able to dedicate yourself for that goal. As others have said, start locally and train as hard as you classes will allow without hurting your grades and you should do well. If you don't have to work for your education, you'll have more time to train and there is probably a TKD course available at the school( I know they are near me). Good luck and hope to see you one day at the Olympics.

 

[mango.man]

LaurenTKD,

It looks like the exact location will be Veterans Memorial Auditorium

http://www.qctimes.com/articles/2008/02/01/ap-state-ia/d8uhjce80.txt

 

[Laurentkd]

Cool!
Thanks!
Anyone going to go just to watch?

 

[darmac]

I think you need to first understand how Olympic TKD works. For instance, do you realize that each country, other than the host nation, can only send a maximum of 4 players to The Olympics? The host nation can send 8.

mango.man, the host nation can also only send 4 players to the Olympics. The only difference is they get automatic entries. The only time the host had entries for all divisions was in Sydney.

 

[mango.man]

You are correct, thanks for clearing that up. Sorry if I caused any unneccessary confusion.