Something I heard From My Instructor

[NCkicks14]

I recently heard that all black belts in TKD are able to kick other black belts in the leg between the knee and the hip in class sparring but not tournaments and testings. For me, this was put into action back in January and has been said they were just playing around with it to try it out but it hasn't been passed officially yet. What do you, as a martial artist, think about this?

 

[Sarah]

I recently heard that all black belts in TKD are able to kick other black belts in the leg between the knee and the hip in class sparring but not tournaments and testings. For me, this was put into action back in January and has been said they were just playing around with it to try it out but it hasn't been passed officially yet. What do you, as a martial artist, think about this?

Do you mean in the Thigh, we kick there when we spar (all grades), but we do wear shin pads.

 

[NCkicks14]

yes the thigh, but its jsut been put into action since january for the tae kwon do america association but its only for black belts

 

[Sarah]

yes the thigh, but its jsut been put into action since january for the tae kwon do america association but its only for black belts

So what’s the theory behind not kicking there?? Don’t you guys kick to the head, body etc, why not the leg?

Our style is TKD based, but we do free sparring, more like kick boxing I guess.

 

[NCkicks14]

yeah we kick to the head and body in free sparring, the only thing i wanted to know was if any other tkd organization did this, because its odd to me, as a sr brown belt to only let the black belts use this and not the other advanced students

 

[TigerWoman]

We don't kick there intentionally because if so, for a black belt to do it, when fighting another black belt would probably cause a good charley horse. That's a self defense move by the way. Usually when two BB flght, the action is ratcheted up, and both are using more force behind their kicks. It seems like a low blow (and is). TW

 

[NCkicks14]

true, i guess it would hurt quite a bit for some of our older black belt participants, no matter how many times the instructor tells them to watch there control...lol

but still, why should only black belts get to use this and the other advanced (brown-sr red) students cant? even if they are just testing this rule out

 

[Sarah]

true, i guess it would hurt quite a bit for some of our older black belt participants, no matter how many times the instructor tells them to watch there control...lol

but still, why should only black belts get to use this and the other advanced (brown-sr red) students cant? even if they are just testing this rule out

How old are the other BB, are you a Jr BB.

I guess if the Brown Belts get to do it the next to be asking the question would be the Green Belts then Yellow Belts. Maybe your Instructor wonted to keep it under control with only BB, until he felt happy with it??

 

[Langdow]

No one ever said a person couldn't kick there, however with your school I think it's probably a safety thing that your instructor feels needs to be followed. Learn control on the body and then kick to the thigh in free fighting.

For self defense application kicking to the thigh/knee is a very valid technique and should be practiced. But again this is a school to school thing and whatever a particular owner/instructor feels is right for their school.

 

[NCkicks14]

no im not a jr bb im just a sr. brown but some of the bb in my school range from between 30-60

but i see where its going, it is just a saftey precaution i guess, he did mention only the thigh and no knee knocking, or to much force to sweep there feet out from under them

 

[MichiganTKD]

Most legitimate Tae Kwon Do schools run by reputable Instructors allow only above the belt kicking for safety reasons. Not to say kicking someone's leg doesn't have its place, just not in free fighting.
I did have a friend who liked to use the low-high side kick combo from Koryo on me, but that was as a check against an incoming kick, not an actual power technique.
One other thing: Traditional Tae Kwon Do is about trying to improve yourself and make high technique. That's hard to do if you're practicing low kicking all the time. Again, works in self defense, not so good for free sparring.

 

[Sarah]

I guess the sparring we do is nothing to do with technical TKD, it is more kickboxing or the like.

No one that I know of in our school has ever been injured kicking the thigh, only the odd bruise here and there, as we are trained to control our kicks etc.

I would find it rather restricting not being able to kick below the waist, as I am not overly flexible yet. Also it would be effective in self defence.

I dont think it is to say that an Instructor is not reputable if he allows these kicks, it would be more to do with the amount of control he has over the training of it.

We train using Low/High techniques i.e. punch low, bring the guard down, kick high or punch high bring the guard up, kick low, you get my drift?

 

[MichiganTKD]

An Instructor is responsible for the training allowed at his/her school. So there is no "depends on how much control he has over training". The Instructor is 100% in control of training, and also of enforcing rules if he belongs to a particular TKD organization (WTF, ITF, ATA etc.) which, to my knowledge, do not allow leg kicking.
A Tae Kwon Do organization using the rules of the major organizations would not allow leg kicking. A school that bases its rules on TKD but allows leg kicking or whatever is, in my opinion, not a TKD school. Kicking the leg is not accepted in any legitimate TKD organization I know of. Unless it is just some independent teacher who does what he wants.

 

[Sarah]

An Instructor is responsible for the training allowed at his/her school. So there is no "depends on how much control he has or training". The Instructor is 100% in control of training. His school, his rules.
A Tae Kwon Do organization using the rules of the major organizations would not allow leg kicking. A school that bases its rules on TKD but allows leg kicking or whatever is, in my opinion, not a TKD school. Kicking the leg is not accepted in any legitimate TKD organization I know of. Unless it is just some independent teacher who does what he wants.

I was trying to get across that we are NOT a TKD organisation, our basics are TKD, ie Hyungs etc. My instructor is not just some independent teacher doing what he wants, we have 3 schools in New Zealand that have been around for quite a while now, and we have strict criteria in our grading system.

We are not solely TKD, we also incorporated Grappling, Balintawak, Judo, Kickboxing, Jujitsu.

And as always in our Dojo safety is important.

My query was more along the line's of is there reason why you dont do thigh kicks or is it just because that's the way its always been done in TKD?

I would have though it is more dangerous to kick to the head than to the thigh, but if I am wrong please enlighten me because as I said I am not trained in Traditional TKD.

 

[MichiganTKD]

Okay Sarah, good question:

Why does Tae Kwon Do not do thigh or leg kicks in free fighting?

One of the precepts of Tae Kwon Do is to try or do what is difficult. This is why we tend to focus more on high kicks and jumping kicks in free fighting. Because they are difficult and thus a challenge to try. Historically this was the ideal in Korean recreation: do what seems impossible.
In Karate, low kicking and middle kicking are valued for practicality. Nothing wrong with it, just a different mindset. Korean culture values what is difficult to do. Therefore, Tae Kwon Do uses more high, jumping, and flying techniqes.

Hope that answers your question.

 

[Marginal]

It also ups the potential for knee injuries, which is largely frowned upon for obvious/legal reasons.

 

[Han-Mi]

Leg kicks can be very dangerous, but they do add another weapon to your arsenal, and can be used to win fights on their own. The important thing is to be trained properly to use them and defend them.
Other than the logistics and dangers of leg kicks I have always been an advocate of letting the lower belt choose the rules. If you do not want to be kicked in the legs, tell them you would prefer they didn't do it. Also, the new rule is probably only refering to black belt vs. black belt matches and they should not use the kicks on the lower ranks.

One question for you is, are you training in olympic TKD or traditional? I never payed much attention to associations and federations. Our studio is quite loosely affiliated with the Kukkiwon, our certificates don't even come directly from them. Our Grandmaster issues them, but they are recognized by the Kukkiwon as valid certification of rank. Tangent^

 

[Sarah]

Okay Sarah, good question:

Why does Tae Kwon Do not do thigh or leg kicks in free fighting?

One of the precepts of Tae Kwon Do is to try or do what is difficult. This is why we tend to focus more on high kicks and jumping kicks in free fighting. Because they are difficult and thus a challenge to try. Historically this was the ideal in Korean recreation: do what seems impossible.
In Karate, low kicking and middle kicking are valued for practicality. Nothing wrong with it, just a different mindset. Korean culture values what is difficult to do. Therefore, Tae Kwon Do uses more high, jumping, and flying techniqes.

Hope that answers your question.

That does help answer my query, thank you.
Do you do any special training at your schools for flexibility and strength to get good at the high kicks, and what do you do with people that are not flexible at the beginning of there training.

I did see an ITF tournament recently, I went to see how different their style is from ours. I noticed there was not a lot of close fighting, guards were low etc, does this come from the fact that you do those difficult kicks, you cant get to close.

Given I am not very knowledgeable in TKD, and with the exception of a few kicks, don't most need to be at a bit of a distance???

 

[Raewyn]

I belong to the same club as Sarah, in fact she's my training partner. Our club allows thigh kicks as we are more into the reality street fighting as she said with TKD as the base to give us a bit of grounding. But we are lucky in the fact that the club incorporates alot of basics from other MA forms, so I think we will become quite well rounded in the way we fight. I personally would rather have a dead leg than to be knocked out cold with a kick to the head. But I've only being doing this a year and still have sooooooooooooooooo much more too learn!!!

 

[Damian Mavis]

Ya what you guys are doing is strictly within your group of schools... .you have to keep in mind that there are MILLIONS of TKD practitioners... 99% are not kicking below the belt, maybe a few do during a self defence application drill but not during sparring.

Some of the comments surrounding leg kicks surprise me. It seems like some of you think getting kicked in the leg is worse than getting kicked in the ribs or head.... the ribs can break and head can be concussed, face can be broken... but your thigh will heal up just fine, you might not walk for a few days but it will recover with no lasting damage. Someone mentioned knee damage.. no, getting kicked in the thigh does not cause knee damage.

I've been kicked in the leg many times and it is always preferable than to get kicked in the head or ribs without blocking.

Damian Mavis
Honour TKD