Smoke Free At The Casinos

[MJS]

A current debate going on here in CT. regarding whether or not the 2 casinos in CT should be totally smoke free. There are smoking and non smoking sections at both, however, some people want to make them totally smoke free, which of course is ruffling some feathers (no pun intended) with the tribes.
http://www.courant.com/news/politics/hc-casino-smoking-ban-0421.artapr21,0,3418444.story

Despite threats of legal action and a potential battle over nearly $400 million a year in slot-machine revenue currently added to state coffers, a key legislative committee voted Monday to ban smoking at the state's two Indian casinos.

The Democratic members on the legislature's government administration and elections committee said they have the right to ban smoking to protect the health of casino workers — including those who have complained about the health effects of second-hand smoke.

But Republican lawmakers said the bill is clearly unconstitutional and would violate the compacts between the state and the Indian tribes that operate the Mohegan Sun and Foxwoods casinos. They said the bill specifically targets casinos while allowing private clubs to continue permitting smoking.

A few things caught my interest:

1) I find it interesting that the state is in such a deficit, yet the casinos give millions to the state. Oddly enough, there was an article on the deficit on the opposite page from the casino issue.

2) I don't smoke, but I grew up in a household that did, and I have other friends and family members that do as well. Personally, it makes me sick, and I can't stand the smell that is left on my clothes afterwards, but I put up with it. However, in a casino, given the fact that a) they're huge so the odds of getting much of a smell of 2nd hand smoke isn't as high as one would think, and b) as I said above, they have non smoking sections, so people simply avoid the smoking areas.

3) Do these same people that complain about the 2nd hand smoke, also complain about the wonderful things that we're breathing in, every time we go outside? I mean think about it, exhaust fumes, smoke from someone passing by you on the street, pollution from factories...the list can go on and on. I mean, you may as well walk around in a bubble.

Personally, I could care less if the casinos are smoke free or not. I don't go often enough to worry about it, and when I do, if it bothers me that much, I stay in the non smoking areas, although I have gone into the other as well.

IMO, it seems like this is another case of someone trying to find something petty to complain about, when there're bigger and more important issues on the table, that should be more of a concern.

 

[Sukerkin]

That last sentence was a very important one :tup:

However, on the subject of smoking in public places, being a born-again-non-smoker if I had my way there'd be special camps for the smokers, far away from any areas of residence for uninfected people ... what :angel:.

On a slightly more serious note, I do find the smell of smoke affects me in dichotomous ways. One reaction is "Yeuk, that stinks" and the other is "Mmm ... tobacco".

The former wins each time tho' - for example, my little sister (well, she's in her late 30's but you get the idea ) got into my car the other night and I could tell instantly that she'd had a smoke. I didn't say anything but I was still offended that she'd brought that stench into my 'personal' space.

 

[MJS]

That last sentence was a very important one :tup:

However, on the subject of smoking in public places, being a born-again-non-smoker if I had my way there'd be special camps for the smokers, far away from any areas of residence for uninfected people ... what :angel:.

On a slightly more serious note, I do find the smell of smoke affects me in dichotomous ways. One reaction is "Yeuk, that stinks" and the other is "Mmm ... tobacco".

The former wins each time tho' - for example, my little sister (well, she's in her late 30's but you get the idea ) got into my car the other night and I could tell instantly that she'd had a smoke. I didn't say anything but I was still offended that she'd brought that stench into my 'personal' space.

Anytime my wife visits her side of the family and then comes back home, I can pick up on the smoke right away. My father was a smoker for many years, and quit, cold, after developing some serious medical issues. He's fine now.

Like I said, I can't stand the smell, and hate to be around people that are smoking, but I deal with it, because its usually only for a short period of time..thank God.

 

[elder999]

Two things-the casinos are on reservations, and not subject to a lot of the same laws, including the ones that are making smoking in public places a thing of the past, unless the tribes pass similar laws themselves.

They're probably not really getting their "feathers ruffled," they just haven't gotten around to telling the people that are complaining to pound sand and go gamble somewhere else if they don't like the smoke-though it's likely (knowing my Mohegan and Mashantucket cousins) that they've taken the position that a smoking ban is negotiable, but only directly between tribal representatives and the state governement-perhaps the governor his or herself, because they are sovereign nations, and not subject to the imposition of state law.

edit: just read the article, apparently that's what they're trying for. In the meantime, I guessthe legislature is trynig to impose a ban? I don't think that's quite.....legal:lol: Odds are good, even if that route succeeds in imposing a ban, they'll just ignore it, and it will be unenforcable.

The other thing, of course, is that tobacco is, after all, an Indian word, and a sacred plant to most tribes that used some form of it, which, in North America, especially on the eastern seaboard, was most tribes, so they are simply unlikely to simply ban its use, or speak of why. Hell, if they're like every other tribe with casino gambling, tax-free cigarettes were a big part of their income long before they had gambling......

 

[Lisa]

The only time I am ever in the Casinos in Winnipeg is to volunteer to work a bingo for our association (we get part of the proceeds to help pay for our trips, etc.) A few years back legislation was introduced that made them completely smoke free. Before it was passed people were worried that it would decrease the traffic in the casinos. Well that didn't happen, the places are as packed as they ever were. The Bingo games take breaks for the smokers to go outside and have their puff of a cigarette.

I understand that smokers have their rights but when their rights directly harm me, then I think their argument loses its validity. I won't ever tell a smoker not to smoke in their home, however, please don't pollute my public air.

 

[elder999]

The I understand that smokers have their rights but when their rights directly harm me, then I think their argument loses its validity. I won't ever tell a smoker not to smoke in their home, however, please don't pollute my public air.

Which, I gather from the article, really isn't at issue. What's at issue is the fact that when you go to one of the casinos in question, you're not "in public' anymore-in a lot of ways, you're no longer in the state of Connecticut, or even the United States-it's complicated, because you are and you aren't, but it's also legal-and that means that they're not subject to the laws of the state-it's part of why they have gambling in the first place. Odds are good that they'll ban smoking-they just won't do it because the state legislature says they have to.

 

[MJS]

Two things-the casinos are on reservations, and not subject to a lot of the same laws, including the ones that are making smoking in public places a thing of the past, unless the tribes pass similar laws themselves.

They're probably not really getting their "feathers ruffled," they just haven't gotten around to telling the people that are complaining to pound sand and go gamble somewhere else if they don't like the smoke-though it's likely (knowing my Mohegan and Mashantucket cousins) that they've taken the position that a smoking ban is negotiable, but only directly between tribal representatives and the state governement-perhaps the governor his or herself, because they are sovereign nations, and not subject to the imposition of state law.

edit: just read the article, apparently that's what they're trying for. In the meantime, I guessthe legislature is trynig to impose a ban? I don't think that's quite.....legal:lol: Odds are good, even if that route succeeds in imposing a ban, they'll just ignore it, and it will be unenforcable.

The other thing, of course, is that tobacco is, after all, an Indian word, and a sacred plant to most tribes that used some form of it, which, in North America, especially on the eastern seaboard, was most tribes, so they are simply unlikely to simply ban its use, or speak of why. Hell, if they're like every other tribe with casino gambling, tax-free cigarettes were a big part of their income long before they had gambling......

I certainly dont disagree with your post. IMO, let them ( the casinos) do what they choose, however, this may be an issue:

Blumenthal said Monday that a ban would be legally enforceable because "both tribes have already agreed — as a condition in their state gaming compacts — to adopt Connecticut's public health standards."

I'm no legal expert, but it'll be interesting to see if the casinos can still challenge this.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Last time I went to the local Indian Casino it was smoke city. I mean I could almost cut the 2nd hand smoke with a knife. I am all for people being able to smoke but hey if it intrudes on everyone else then isn't that a problem?

 

[Carol]

Last time I went to the local Indian Casino it was smoke city. I mean I could almost cut the 2nd hand smoke with a knife. I am all for people being able to smoke but hey if it intrudes on everyone else then isn't that a problem?

The casino complexes in CT all have large non-smoking casinos so it is possible to enjoy the gaming without being immersed in smoke. I don't know what the theatres and other activities are like...I know I'd rather not take a show in an auditorium filled with smoke.

 

[Gordon Nore]

Question: Is it proper for state legislatures to rule on what takes place in Native casinos? I assume this is on Native lands.

 

[MJS]

The casino complexes in CT all have large non-smoking casinos so it is possible to enjoy the gaming without being immersed in smoke. I don't know what the theatres and other activities are like...I know I'd rather not take a show in an auditorium filled with smoke.

The UFC came to Mohegan a few years ago. It was non smoking. But I agree...if I'm paying big bucks for a show, the last thing I'd want is to get stuck next to a smoke stack for a few hours.

 

[MJS]

Question: Is it proper for state legislatures to rule on what takes place in Native casinos?

I would have to say no, it is not proper. However, as one part in that article stated, it seems the tribes may have agreed to something:

"Blumenthal said Monday that a ban would be legally enforceable because "both tribes have already agreed — as a condition in their state gaming compacts — to adopt Connecticut's public health standards."

I assume this is on Native lands.

AFAIK, yes it is.

 

[Carol]

There seem to be some types of agreements between the tribes and the state. When a friend and I were at Foxwoods last fall, we noticed that the bars shut down at 1am and the "cocktail" waitresses started offering coffee and water to the players. I also saw some of uniformed CT staties here and there.

 

[grydth]

So if this law passes, you can drink yourself into a stupor while you gamble the rent money away.....but you can't smoke because that's bad for you.

The state is a poor nanny.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Smoke, don't smoke, I don't care which they do. As one of the many former smokers, I can agree that the smell of cigarette smoke now gives me a raging headache and the stink of the smoke on my clothes won't go away until I wash them - but I would not deny another person the right to smoke.

However, I won't go into a restaurant or bar that allows smoking. Their choice to allow it or not, no problem from me there. But they don't get my business, and it's not to punish them - just that I can't take the smoke, sorry.

 

[Rich Parsons]

A current debate going on here in CT. regarding whether or not the 2 casinos in CT should be totally smoke free. There are smoking and non smoking sections at both, however, some people want to make them totally smoke free, which of course is ruffling some feathers (no pun intended) with the tribes.
http://www.courant.com/news/politics/hc-casino-smoking-ban-0421.artapr21,0,3418444.story


A few things caught my interest:

If the land for the Casino is ruled to be Tribal lands then I support the Tribe deciding even though I would prefer a non smoking place myself.

1) I find it interesting that the state is in such a deficit, yet the casinos give millions to the state. Oddly enough, there was an article on the deficit on the opposite page from the casino issue.

In Michigan the Lotto and Lottery supports education, the problem is that the monies initially allocated for education have gone back to the general fund, so there was not a real increase in education spending.

2) I don't smoke, but I grew up in a household that did, and I have other friends and family members that do as well. Personally, it makes me sick, and I can't stand the smell that is left on my clothes afterwards, but I put up with it. However, in a casino, given the fact that a) they're huge so the odds of getting much of a smell of 2nd hand smoke isn't as high as one would think, and b) as I said above, they have non smoking sections, so people simply avoid the smoking areas.

I don't smoke. I grew up with parents that smoked. My mom quit when she got cancer (* Adrenal not lung, but it did weaken her lung capacity which did effect her treatments *), my dad quit soon after that as well. He still occasional will chew, but that does not cause second hand smoke.

If there are smoke free sections I will go there. But I find that many times the ventilation is not proper and or one has to walk through the smoking section to get to a smoke free environment.

Note: I am less bothered by Cigar smoke than the horrible cigarette smoke.

3) Do these same people that complain about the 2nd hand smoke, also complain about the wonderful things that we're breathing in, every time we go outside? I mean think about it, exhaust fumes, smoke from someone passing by you on the street, pollution from factories...the list can go on and on. I mean, you may as well walk around in a bubble.

Yes and no.

Second hand smoke has Cyanide that attacks the red blood cells and limits oxygen flow to the body and the brain. The brain is where the "RUSH" part comes from. There is no Cyanide in the exhaust from a vehicle. There might be some methane, and on a diesel some particulates, but for a vehicle to cigarette, I would rather be in a garage with the car running than a cigarette smoker.

I disagree with the bubble comment, as most of the factories cannot produce cyanide and other such chemicals that come out from second hand smoke.

I can work in a garage all day and not feel hung over the next day, but if I am around a smoker (* not drinking *) I feel dehydrated and hung over the next morning beside having to take a shower just to get the smell out of my hair so I can go to bed.

Personally, I could care less if the casinos are smoke free or not. I don't go often enough to worry about it, and when I do, if it bothers me that much, I stay in the non smoking areas, although I have gone into the other as well.

As I do not gamble all that often if at all, it does not directly effect me, but smoke free environments are something I support in theory and in application. But as stated above I respect that in this case if it is a Nation issue with the Indians, I support them deciding.

IMO, it seems like this is another case of someone trying to find something petty to complain about, when there're bigger and more important issues on the table, that should be more of a concern.

Yes there are bigger issues. But, while those bigger issues are on the table, I still see proposed legislation for taxing internet activity and firearms and ammo and limitation on such. Personally I say clean air is much more important than limiting me access to a firearm.

The only time I am ever in the Casinos in Winnipeg is to volunteer to work a bingo for our association (we get part of the proceeds to help pay for our trips, etc.) A few years back legislation was introduced that made them completely smoke free. Before it was passed people were worried that it would decrease the traffic in the casinos. Well that didn't happen, the places are as packed as they ever were. The Bingo games take breaks for the smokers to go outside and have their puff of a cigarette.

I understand that smokers have their rights but when their rights directly harm me, then I think their argument loses its validity. I won't ever tell a smoker not to smoke in their home, however, please don't pollute my public air.

I agree with Lisa here.

In Chicago, they are smoke free in the bars. I really enjoyed it. The smokers had to go outside to smoke and could not stand by the door. So, while walking in I was not assaulted by the cigarette smoke and I felt much better enjoying a beer on the inside without the smoke.



****************

My Thought provoking comment:

If the cyanide does limit oxygen to the brain, how does this assault to my person differ from someone putting their hands on my throat or poisoning me with cyanide in my drink?

Is it not still an attack on my person and body?

 

[MJS]

So if this law passes, you can drink yourself into a stupor while you gamble the rent money away.....but you can't smoke because that's bad for you.

The state is a poor nanny.

Pretty much. There was talk about letting the casinos serve drinks all night, instead of stopping at, and dont hold me to the times, as they might not be exact, but stop serving around 1am on the weekdays and 2am on weekends. However that got shot down soon after it was brought up, due to a fatal crash. The cause? A drunk driver, who crashed into a shuttle bus.

But yes, that does seem screwed up. Places that you can take out a 2nd mortgage on your house, but you can't smoke in a designated area?

 

[MJS]

If the land for the Casino is ruled to be Tribal lands then I support the Tribe deciding even though I would prefer a non smoking place myself.

There are smoke free sections in the casino for the purpose.

In Michigan the Lotto and Lottery supports education, the problem is that the monies initially allocated for education have gone back to the general fund, so there was not a real increase in education spending.

Same thing in CT. It seems to work out to about half of the winnings. Still....people cry about the deficit, and all this leftover $$$$. Something funny is going on IMO.

I don't smoke. I grew up with parents that smoked. My mom quit when she got cancer (* Adrenal not lung, but it did weaken her lung capacity which did effect her treatments *), my dad quit soon after that as well. He still occasional will chew, but that does not cause second hand smoke.

If there are smoke free sections I will go there. But I find that many times the ventilation is not proper and or one has to walk through the smoking section to get to a smoke free environment.

Note: I am less bothered by Cigar smoke than the horrible cigarette smoke.

I'd rather walk nearby and get a quick whiff, rather than sitting next to the Q-tip, who's working on her 10th cig. LOL!

BTW, cigar smoke is just as nasty as a cig, but I too am less bothered.

Yes and no.

Second hand smoke has Cyanide that attacks the red blood cells and limits oxygen flow to the body and the brain. The brain is where the "RUSH" part comes from. There is no Cyanide in the exhaust from a vehicle. There might be some methane, and on a diesel some particulates, but for a vehicle to cigarette, I would rather be in a garage with the car running than a cigarette smoker.

I disagree with the bubble comment, as most of the factories cannot produce cyanide and other such chemicals that come out from second hand smoke.

I can work in a garage all day and not feel hung over the next day, but if I am around a smoker (* not drinking *) I feel dehydrated and hung over the next morning beside having to take a shower just to get the smell out of my hair so I can go to bed.

Its still bad to breath. I mean if people commit suicide by means of letting the car run in an enclosed area.....sounds deadly to me. As for the garages....they have an exhaust method, so that helps.

As I do not gamble all that often if at all, it does not directly effect me, but smoke free environments are something I support in theory and in application. But as stated above I respect that in this case if it is a Nation issue with the Indians, I support them deciding.

Agreed.

Yes there are bigger issues. But, while those bigger issues are on the table, I still see proposed legislation for taxing internet activity and firearms and ammo and limitation on such. Personally I say clean air is much more important than limiting me access to a firearm.

Agreed.

I agree with Lisa here.

In Chicago, they are smoke free in the bars. I really enjoyed it. The smokers had to go outside to smoke and could not stand by the door. So, while walking in I was not assaulted by the cigarette smoke and I felt much better enjoying a beer on the inside without the smoke.

I don't really frequent bars/clubs, but there is a sports bar within walking distance from where I live. I see people outside all the time, so I'm assuming that it is smoke free, which is nice.

 

[Drac]

Whenever they talk about Ohio finally getting casinos I laugh...They could line the shores of the Cuyahoga River with them(which is something they should have done years ago) and I still wont attend..Ya want me to sit at a blackjack table and gamble my hard earned cash away, and not have a ciggie??? Not gonna happen....Thank God for Las Vegas..

 

[Drac]

IMO, it seems like this is another case of someone trying to find something petty to complain about

TRUE STORY TIME: Flew to Vegas once ( and only once) on a gamblers junket..The wife and I were spelling each other for smoke breaks outside..Coming back inside once the wind carried the smell of the cigarette with me, a older woman that was standing between the inner and outer doors gives me the standard non smoker speech about the smell, yadda, yadda, yadda..I give her a whatever comment and get back in line...Later that night I find this same woman seated 2 machines down from me in Harrahs in the smoking section..I lit one up and purposly blow smoke discreetly in her direction...She is oblivious to it..