Should the UN be dissolved?

[TwistofFat]

Folks,

I was going to post this under the US as Rogue state thread but think this may deserve its own thread.

Without the US bad, World good or UN bad, US good point-counter point going nowhere, I have some serious concerns about the UN as a viable worldwide collaborative body.

The big issues to me are Dafur, the Oil for food program and fiscal mismanagement gone nuts (yes, the US trillion+ jumble is laughable).

I do not want to paste lengthy articles on these but any google will produce dozens from many different new/old media. They are all saying the same thing - it's broken (http://www.iht.com/articles/541766.html). The real concerns for me include Russia, France and Germany are blocking any investigation into this black hole where funds good have done some good. Kofi Annan, his son Kojo and many others have real questions to answer.

Sudan - Dafur Region - Rape, forced prostitution and murder with no oversight or accountablility. No one wants to commit more than token funds/troops.

I am not advocating the isolation of the US. NATO, and other world organzations (AIDS, World Heath Organization, etc) seem to be effective and have some review/audit trail.

I am advocating an full disclosure from the UN on budget and humanitarian efforts. The issue is who would be the independant body to do the investigations. Kofi Annan and his son can not be trusted to investigate themselves.

If there is no trust of the basics of government (of the people for the...), The UN's value is little more than empty speeches.

 

[michaeledward]

Is your argument that because the 'Oil for Food' program was abused, and some of that money found its way into Saddam Hussien's hands that the United Nations should be desolved?


Is your argument that because there is a civil war in Sudan, with ongoing genocide, and the United Nations has yet to act as decisively as you would like, that it should be desolved?

Isn't that a bit like throwing the baby out with the bath water?

In any large organization, there are opportunities for corruption, and we must always stay vigilent for such abuses. We must stop them when they occur. But, there is an awful lot being done by the 191 member nations that should continue being done.

There are currently 16 peacekeeping operations going on around the globe, should we just pack those up and send everyone home?

http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/dpko/bnote.htm

I think perhaps, the bigger issue is why don't we know more about what the United Nations does.

 

[Flatlander]

Is your argument that because the 'Oil for Food' program was abused, and some of that money found its way into Saddam Hussien's hands that the United Nations should be desolved?


Is your argument that because there is a civil war in Sudan, with ongoing genocide, and the United Nations has yet to act as decisively as you would like, that it should be desolved?

Isn't that a bit like throwing the baby out with the bath water?

In any large organization, there are opportunities for corruption, and we must always stay vigilent for such abuses. We must stop them when they occur. But, there is an awful lot being done by the 191 member nations that should continue being done.

There are currently 16 peacekeeping operations going on around the globe, should we just pack those up and send everyone home?

http://www.un.org/Depts/dpko/dpko/bnote.htm

I think perhaps, the bigger issue is why don't we know more about what the United Nations does.

Perhaps dissolving the UN is excessive, however, there are most certainly problems that require attention: From this article today:

New York — Vivid allegations of widespread corruption at the UN oil-for-food program by the top U.S. arms inspector have added credibility to accusations that the United Nations looked the other way while Saddam Hussein's government skimmed billions of dollars and offered kickbacks to European and Arab countries and officials.

The inspector's report implicates the top UN official overseeing the $60-billion program, accusing him of accepting bribes in the form of vouchers for Iraqi oil sales, and details Iraqi manipulation to illegally enrich Mr. Hussein's government and influence Security Council members.

The alleged schemes included an Iraqi system for allocating lucrative oil vouchers, which permitted recipients to purchase certain amounts of oil at a profit, according to the report issued Wednesday by Charles Duelfer, head of the Iraq Survey Group.

Now, I have been one of the loudest espousing support of the UN, bolstering its usefulness and responsibility, however,

The report estimates that Mr. Hussein generated $10.9-billion (U.S.) in hard currency through illicit means from 1990 to 2003 during the entire sanctions period.

And THAT is a ton of cash. How could this have gone on for so long unchecked?

What is most distressing to me is that many of Hussein's people were living in squalor, and Benon Sevan was lookeing the other way while Hussien padded his pockets, and those of other interested parties.

I am gravely concerned about our future. Integrity seems to be in short supply.

 

[PeachMonkey]

Perhaps dissolving the UN is excessive, however, there are most certainly problems that require attention

From another article on the oil for food problem:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A13313-2004Oct6.html?sub=AR

"Several American companies on the list, compiled from 13 documents kept by Hussein's vice president and oil minister, were given vouchers to purchase billions of dollars of oil at discounted prices. The U.S. companies are not named in the report because of privacy laws, U.S. officials said."

Heaven forbid we name those US companies! It's all those *other* countries that were helping Hussein, these poor US companies were just trying to make an honest buck.

[sarcasm]Maybe we should disband those US companies as well as the UN. Heck, let's disband the United States![/sarcasm]

 

[heretic888]

Yup, that's it.

Dissolve an organization whose only purpose is to provide a forum by which to discuss international affairs. Because, discussion = bad, and reckless action = good.

Let's not forget all that horrid humanitarian aid the UN has given over the past several decades.

I wonder if this question would still be asked if we didn't have that "f*ck you, world!" cowboy in office that we do now?? Hrmmm....

 

[PeachMonkey]

I wonder if this question would still be asked if we didn't have that "f*ck you, world!" cowboy in office that we do now?? Hrmmm....

Sadly, the John Birchers and Black Helicopters crowd have been screaming about the United Nations for a long, long, long time.

 

[TwistofFat]

let that be a lession to me for posting in haste and going out of town. The issue for me was:

"I am not advocating the isolation of the US. NATO, and other world organzations (AIDS, World Heath Organization, etc) seem to be effective and have some review/audit trail.

I am advocating an full disclosure from the UN on budget and humanitarian efforts. The issue is who would be the independant body to do the investigations. Kofi Annan and his son can not be trusted to investigate themselves.

If there is no trust of the basics of government (of the people for the...), The UN's value is little more than empty speeches."

TRANSPARENCY of funds. The humanitarian funds also come from the US. US companies have been unethical - Global Crossing, Inacom, Enron...H88 - Yeah, I would ask the same F*&^% question. I am asking it. Does it not bother anyone else that while the working folks at the UN on the ground in **** holes around the world are getting shot at trying to feed thse poor bastards - the leadership is robbing the UN blind...somehow that became Bush's fault...those poor right wing nuts asking questions again. There are degrees of paranoia.

BTW - we paid for the blcak helos.