police

[Athena]

My mom was driving on the highway a few nights ago and got pulled over for speeding, which got me thinking about a few safely issues. First of all, it was dark outside and she was pulled over away from any towns. The policeman shown a flashlight in her window over her shoulder, and so she couldn't even see his face when he was talking to her. Nothing happened obviously; it was business as usual and she got a ticket, but it seems like there were so many opportunities for something to go wrong. How do you protect yourself in a situation like that?

 

[Tony]

Although the Police are supposed to be beyond reproach there are a minority who would take advantage of their power. Fair enough if the Policeman was doing his job but if he had an ulterior motive for stopping a woman on her own then its a serious question on how you protect yourself from a corrupt Police officer. She could have refused to get out of her car and stay in the car with the doors locked, however that could have been seen as not cooperting, which in turn could lead to all sorts of trouble.
I don't know much about the the laws in America or the procedure Police use to stop motorists but over here when people are stopped on the Motorway there are usually two Police officers, and if someone has been speeding they officers take them to their car and show them how much they were speeding by on the computer, and lecture them.
You hear of so many cases of Police officers being beaten up by angry motorists, criminals and the like but thats not to say that they themselves are above the law. I think your best defence would be to make yourself familiar with the law, cooperate with the officer but if he crosses the line then you should ask to speak to his superior!

 

[loki09789]

If you get pulled over, you are completely within your rights to crack your window and tell the officer that you would feel more comfortable if the paper work is done at a station or at least at the nearest public/populated parking lot. you can also ask for ID to verify the officer's authenticity. If it is an unmarked car with an officer in a casual or partial uniform, they will probably not give you a load of crap. If it is an officer in full uniform, in a fully marked car, they might get upset, but you can request another officer on the scene to witness. It won't go over well, or make your day easier, but if you are that concerned that the officer isn't legit or has abusive intentions, go for it.

If it is a case of a police officer abusing his power and attempting to assault/rape the civilian, treat him the same as you would if it were an armed Bad guy in the same situation. Get license numbers, names, badge numbers, discriptions.... for reporting purposes.

 

[Black Bear]

Mr. Prime Minister has really been on The Correct lately. I suspect that he has The Correct tied and gagged in the back of a windowless van.

A genuine police officer who is himself an evil, violent individual is the self-defenser's worst nightmare. But there are steps that can be taken to stay safe. There always are.

 

[OULobo]

We had a situation a little like this here in OH. A woman from MI had the lifestyle where she and her husband didn't agree with local laws and didn't trust any LEOs, so she refused to stop until they were off the freeway and in a truckstop. The officer was suspicious, but just followed her to the truck stop. There wasn't any problem with her choosing to go to the exit. The rest of the story is what made it newsworthy (she was pulled over for breatfeeding in the car while driving and didn't have a driver's licence).

 

[loki09789]

Mr. Prime Minister has really been on The Correct lately. I suspect that he has The Correct tied and gagged in the back of a windowless van.

A genuine police officer who is himself an evil, violent individual is the self-defenser's worst nightmare. But there are steps that can be taken to stay safe. There always are.

It's my ball and I WON'T give it back! The Correct's left eye will be mailed to you to prove that I am not faking.... but won't that make the Correct INCorrect because it will suffer a perception problem

 

[Black Bear]

OULobo, I find it interesting when there are people who don't "buy into the social contract". Often rural folks, they figure that they need not comply to laws they don't agree with, and make no apology for this. Kinda like, hey I was born here, I'm going to live here, I leave everyone else alone, you better stay out of my face, cold dead fingers, etc... There are quite a few folks like that in the USA, aren't there?

On some level I'm kind of sympathetic to that kind of ideology. But then, they're driving on public roads along with the rest of people... some kind of understanding has got to be worked out...

 

[OULobo]

OULobo, I find it interesting when there are people who don't "buy into the social contract". Often rural folks, they figure that they need not comply to laws they don't agree with, and make no apology for this. Kinda like, hey I was born here, I'm going to live here, I leave everyone else alone, you better stay out of my face, cold dead fingers, etc... There are quite a few folks like that in the USA, aren't there?

On some level I'm kind of sympathetic to that kind of ideology. But then, they're driving on public roads along with the rest of people... some kind of understanding has got to be worked out...

Apparently, we have an unusually large pop. of them here in OH and in MI, and consequently in CO and UT. Most of them get along just fine with everyone because the are in the boonies or in communities that accept their beliefs in the interests of community peace, but when there are clashes with the rest of society and authority in particular things get a little sticky. From what I know of them, they don't think the constitution allows the Fed. Gov. issue them rules, laws or orders.

I'm of the same mindset as you, in that part of me sympathises with them, but they resist in the wrong ways. I always say "Don't Poke the Bear". It's a slogan of mine. Basically, if you see a bear in the woods, don't be stupid and run up and start poking him. All you are going to get is hurt. Same thing goes at the bar. I know people who used to run up to a group of 10 frat guys and yell "Your frat is a bunch of P***ies." and then wonder why they got pounded. Same idea, if you flick a booger at the government, you better do it in an acceptable way or when no one's around, otherwise don't cry when the ATF torches your shack. Reality vs. Idealism.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

At the risk of unpopularly siding with Law Enforcement...

I don't know if it's at a national level, or just here on the west coast of SoCal where all the fruits, nuts and flakes settle, but tha stats are that...
1. An officers #1 likely place of being harmed was on a domestic dispute call.
2. An officers new #1 most-likely place to get shot is on a traffic stop. Doesn't even have to be a car full of gang-bangers...just a car.

Can you blame them for taking every opportunity to keep the driver & passengers at a strategic disadvantage? If I were a cop with these stats, I'd aim a Q-beam in their eyes and have them step out of the car...and then if they wanted to do it at the station, fine...less likely to get shot.

Namaste!

Dr. Dave

 

[Rich Parsons]

At the risk of unpopularly siding with Law Enforcement...

I don't know if it's at a national level, or just here on the west coast of SoCal where all the fruits, nuts and flakes settle, but tha stats are that...
1. An officers #1 likely place of being harmed was on a domestic dispute call.
2. An officers new #1 most-likely place to get shot is on a traffic stop. Doesn't even have to be a car full of gang-bangers...just a car.

Can you blame them for taking every opportunity to keep the driver & passengers at a strategic disadvantage? If I were a cop with these stats, I'd aim a Q-beam in their eyes and have them step out of the car...and then if they wanted to do it at the station, fine...less likely to get shot.

Namaste!

Dr. Dave

Dave,

I was driving a car for work, had lots of computer stuff in it. Wierd lights flashing and glowing at night. Not too bad, but visible to other vehicles. I was pulled over for speeding. Transitions from a 65 MPH to 55 MPH and I was engine braking and running a test. I crossed the sign at 60 mph. I was obviously speeding. They hit the lights behind me and pulled me over. I did not know they were there, as it was an expressway interchange. Both approached the vehicle with weapons drawn, one on each side. I had interior lights on and hands on the wheel. The lead officer at my window smiled and asked me my paperwork after he put away is firearm. The other was not convinced and staid back to cover. They thought it was funny, for they would not have pulled me over if not for all the funny lights and glows. I even had to show them the trunk with compuer equipment. Then they apologized for writing me a speeding ticket. Michigan State Police policy is to issue a ticket at all stops, usually. Well the ticket was for 60 MP in a 55 MPH in a previous zoned 70 MPH. This meant a $70 fine and no points. An Equipment inop would have been $80 or $120 depending upon malfunction. I paid the ticket, and the clerk asked where was my case number. I replied I just wanted to pay the ticket. It was soo much cheaper that way. Oh and I was noy upset by the way they approached the vehicle.

 

[Black Bear]

I don't know if it's at a national level, or just here on the west coast of SoCal where all the fruits, nuts and flakes settle

It's like a big bowl of muesli. Mmm, I haven't had that in awhile. I wish I were eating muesli right now. Mental note: buy muesli.

I was also told that vehicle stops are the most dangerous thing that cops do, so when I've been stopped I was always very nice about it.

 

[RCastillo]

Dave,

I was driving a car for work, had lots of computer stuff in it. Wierd lights flashing and glowing at night. Not too bad, but visible to other vehicles. I was pulled over for speeding. Transitions from a 65 MPH to 55 MPH and I was engine braking and running a test. I crossed the sign at 60 mph. I was obviously speeding. They hit the lights behind me and pulled me over. I did not know they were there, as it was an expressway interchange. Both approached the vehicle with weapons drawn, one on each side. I had interior lights on and hands on the wheel. The lead officer at my window smiled and asked me my paperwork after he put away is firearm. The other was not convinced and staid back to cover. They thought it was funny, for they would not have pulled me over if not for all the funny lights and glows. I even had to show them the trunk with compuer equipment. Then they apologized for writing me a speeding ticket. Michigan State Police policy is to issue a ticket at all stops, usually. Well the ticket was for 60 MP in a 55 MPH in a previous zoned 70 MPH. This meant a $70 fine and no points. An Equipment inop would have been $80 or $120 depending upon malfunction. I paid the ticket, and the clerk asked where was my case number. I replied I just wanted to pay the ticket. It was soo much cheaper that way. Oh and I was noy upset by the way they approached the vehicle.

You shoulda faked em out with da math! :uhyeah:

 

[Tgace]

If you get pulled over, you are completely within your rights to crack your window and tell the officer that you would feel more comfortable if the paper work is done at a station or at least at the nearest public/populated parking lot. you can also ask for ID to verify the officer's authenticity. If it is an unmarked car with an officer in a casual or partial uniform, they will probably not give you a load of crap. If it is an officer in full uniform, in a fully marked car, they might get upset, but you can request another officer on the scene to witness. It won't go over well, or make your day easier, but if you are that concerned that the officer isn't legit or has abusive intentions, go for it.

If it is a case of a police officer abusing his power and attempting to assault/rape the civilian, treat him the same as you would if it were an armed Bad guy in the same situation. Get license numbers, names, badge numbers, discriptions.... for reporting purposes.

Ya beat me to it bud. :CTF:

 

[loki09789]

Ya beat me to it bud. :CTF:

Shorter arms and legs, less distance to travel at my optimal distance.... I usually do

 

[Tgace]

Isnt there something about short limbs and.......ahhh forget it.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

Isnt there something about short limbs and.......ahhh forget it.

Touche'

 

[Tgace]

Michigan State Police policy is to issue a ticket at all stops,

Hmmm...that may be true, but i would think that its more of a CYA thing amongst the troopers rather than a "policy". In my dept. I dont "have" to issue a ticket for anything, but if the stop results in an arrest and/or the driver acts like he may file a complaint (accidents are a different story), I will issue a summons to explain the reason for the initial traffic stop.

Other than that I may tell a little white lie like "my dept. wants me to write stop sign infractions as a result of citizen complaints". To forestall any arguement or bad attitude from the driver.

%-}
road pirate

 

[Rich Parsons]

Hmmm...that may be true, but i would think that its more of a CYA thing amongst the troopers rather than a "policy". In my dept. I dont "have" to issue a ticket for anything, but if the stop results in an arrest and/or the driver acts like he may file a complaint (accidents are a different story), I will issue a summons to explain the reason for the initial traffic stop.

Other than that I may tell a little white lie like "my dept. wants me to write stop sign infractions as a result of citizen complaints". To forestall any arguement or bad attitude from the driver.

%-}
road pirate

They do it all accidents, this lists someone at least more than 50% at fault or it shows the judge which way the officer was thinking or leaning as he was the first response unit.

Maybe policy is not true as in written, yet, almost everytime I ahve talked to them, they have said the same thing. Even when I was not the one getting the ticket .

 

[jfarnsworth]

When I started reading the first post it was almost exactly to the "T" word for word from another female that I know. Unfortunately for her she didn't have the same out come. After the perp. beat up a police officer and took his flashlight and gun he took off in the car. Apparnetly he had seen her "possibly" through the window of her car and immediatley turned the car around. He managed to get the lights turned on and she pulled over. Upon coming to the car he put the flashlight in her face then ordered her out of the car. She thought he may have used that instance to see if there were any other passengers. At this point she had slightly argued with him and how he pulled her over then she heard the gun chamber and felt it on the side of her head. He beat her in the face with the gun then kidnapped her. He also used her as a hostage for 3 days. Luckily enough for her she manged to play act into his game and seduce him. That bought her enough time to get away from him. My point to all women is to always be cautious. Things just may not always appear as they should.

 

[Mark L]

I'd aim a Q-beam in their eyes and have them step out of the car...

Dr. Dave

I've had this done to me before, the spot light from the cruiser reflecting off of a large side view mirror and the maglight right into my face. I couldn't see the LEO approaching or standing at my door. I was asked to roll down my window and give my license and registration. I cracked the window and said, quite politely, I'm not going to do anything until you get those lights out of my eyes so I can see who you are. He did, it didn't become an issue. I have the right to protect myself, too.