Period of indecision....

[Lobo]

I dont know if i should start it or not. Originally, i wanted to do Krav Maga, mainly because its practical street fighting, and eskrima (because Krav maga can help me disable, while eskrima could help me use opponents weapon against him effectively) but a friend said Ninjitsu is very effective. I looked and looked but i couldn't find an accurate picture of Ninjitsu/Bujinkan. I dont know if its the corny ninja stuff, or if its actually effective. Is Ninjitsu like Krav Maga (check videos for awesome clips)?: practical, natural, effective, no need for brute force, and fairs well in the street? I personally believe there is no use for swords at the momment, becuase no one is going to use a sword in the street, but its always good to learn. Is it a fancy Krav? I know what it is (history), i just dont know what it is...:idunno: please help, and fast!
-Thank you,
K

 

[Lobo]

Also, is it a specialized type of art, much like Judo/BJJ where grappling and throwing are of more importance, or is it more general? Does it train you for different situations like Krav Maga? Is it more striking (I personally dont like arts with too much striking)? And is all this easy to learn?- http://www.geocities.com/kingsburgbujinkan/tenryaku.html

 

[Shizen Shigoku]

Lobo: "I looked and looked but i couldn't find an accurate picture of Ninjitsu/Bujinkan."

dang ninjers always hiding . . .

try this: http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96781308/K=b....go.ro/demo.asf

"I dont know if its the corny ninja stuff, ..."

eh . . . a little bit.

"...or if its actually effective."

mostly.

"Is Ninjitsu like Krav Maga ...?"

no.



"...practical, natural, effective, no need for brute force, and fairs well in the street?"

yes.

"Also, is it a specialized type of art, ...?"

no.
unless you count specializing in natural movement and a lot of sneakiness.

"And is all this easy to learn?- http://www.geocities.com/kingsburgbu.../tenryaku.html"

yeah, most of it. The sanshin and kihon happo take a pretty long time to get the hang of, and some people have a hard time with some of the rolls. All of those things are considered bare minimum to know by shodan (black belt).


Here's some other video clips found after a quick google search:
http://kihon.com/dojo/movies.html
http://www.mizunagaredojo.com/What%20is%20Bujinkan%20Streaming%20Medium.wmv
couple short clips here too: http://www.mbdojo.com/basics.html
and here's one of Hatsumi sensei himself: http://www.sanshin.dk/files/hatsumi_taikai98.wmv

You can find this stuff yourself if you know how to look.


You're welcome.

 

[saru1968]

'I personally believe there is no use for swords at the momment, becuase no one is going to use a sword in the street'


hmmm...replace katana with baseball bat!

 

[Koinu]

I dont know if i should start it or not.

Niether do we so why ask us ? What I can say is if you appoach this style with some sort of preconceptions about what YOU think real Martial arts are then this is not the style for you.

Originally, i wanted to do Krav Maga, mainly because its practical street fighting, and eskrima (because Krav maga can help me disable, while eskrima could help me use opponents weapon against him effectively) but a friend said Ninjitsu is very effective.

Street fighting OH what a "cliche" this phrase has become. Sounds like Krav maga is going to land you in legal hot water as your not looking to avoid trouble/conflict but to confront it head on with your new found skills.
Trust a friend with your life loose both in the bargin. (thanks to who evers sign, that is)

I looked and looked but i couldn't find an accurate picture of Ninjitsu/Bujinkan. I dont know if its the corny ninja stuff, or if its actually effective. Is Ninjitsu like Krav Maga (check videos for awesome clips)?: practical, natural, effective, no need for brute force, and fairs well in the street?

That is because there is NO accurate picture of Ninjutsu/Bujinkan , it is like trying to take a picture of a fast moving Nascar with a box browie camera.
No it does not fair well on the street because all the (cliche) "streetfights" I have ever seen are just Ego contests from one side or both sides. To learn from this art you need to have your ego in check at least, the goal being to fully understand how ego will work for and against you. Now I am sure someone will say OH but what about if you get attacked on the street! Well this style requires TOTAL freedom to be fully effective that is freedom from All legal, moral and eithical worries. So if you are attacked on the street RUN , Call the Police , if you are cornered and have no phone well then you have a little legal freedom that will allow you to protect yourself until you reach that legal line in the sand again.Even in warfare these days there is NOT total freedom as you still have rules of engagement , Genv convention , chain of command etc etc.

I personally believe there is no use for swords at the momment, becuase no one is going to use a sword in the street, but its always good to learn.
-Thank you,

This is one of your preconceptions about things again now isn't it! I could post 100 storys in the news in recent years about this. Let me just say this, someone I have trained with was attacked by a group of people in his own home one wielding a sword. He was badly injured but still managed to kill one and severly wound another one of his attackers with thier own sword. He most certainly did not win, only survived and is still paying the mental an legal costs to this day, even though he was not charged over the the matter due to it being self defence. The other fact you seem to overlook is the fact that swords like all other martial tools, teach you MUCH much more than how to just use or deal with swords . Again your preconceptions about martial arts.

 

[Lobo]

Niether do we so why ask us ? What I can say is if you appoach this style with some sort of preconceptions about what YOU think real Martial arts are then this is not the style for you.
Yeah... i was just posting my doubts, not asking for your opinion. But i was looking forward for advice, but got critism instead.



Street fighting OH what a "cliche" this phrase has become. Sounds like Krav maga is going to land you in legal hot water as your not looking to avoid trouble/conflict but to confront it head on with your new found skills.
Trust a friend with your life loose both in the bargin. (thanks to who evers sign, that is)
As cliche as it is, its the only time i would use a martial art. Especially around my area.


That is because there is NO accurate picture of Ninjutsu/Bujinkan , it is like trying to take a picture of a fast moving Nascar with a box browie camera.
No it does not fair well on the street because all the (cliche) "streetfights" I have ever seen are just Ego contests from one side or both sides. To learn from this art you need to have your ego in check at least, the goal being to fully understand how ego will work for and against you. Now I am sure someone will say OH but what about if you get attacked on the street! Well this style requires TOTAL freedom to be fully effective that is freedom from All legal, moral and eithical worries. So if you are attacked on the street RUN , Call the Police , if you are cornered and have no phone well then you have a little legal freedom that will allow you to protect yourself until you reach that legal line in the sand again.Even in warfare these days there is NOT total freedom as you still have rules of engagement , Genv convention , chain of command etc etc.

ok, thanks.


This is one of your preconceptions about things again now isn't it! I could post 100 storys in the news in recent years about this. Let me just say this, someone I have trained with was attacked by a group of people in his own home one wielding a sword. He was badly injured but still managed to kill one and severly wound another one of his attackers with thier own sword. He most certainly did not win, only survived and is still paying the mental an legal costs to this day, even though he was not charged over the the matter due to it being self defence. The other fact you seem to overlook is the fact that swords like all other martial tools, teach you MUCH much more than how to just use or deal with swords . Again your preconceptions about martial arts.

Well, i dont know if its legal to walk around with a katana in Nyc, but once again, i said its always good to learn.

All in all, thanks.

 

[Lobo]

Lobo: "I looked and looked but i couldn't find an accurate picture of Ninjitsu/Bujinkan."

dang ninjers always hiding . . .

try this: http://rds.yahoo.com/S=96781308/K=b....go.ro/demo.asf

"I dont know if its the corny ninja stuff, ..."

eh . . . a little bit.

"...or if its actually effective."

mostly.

"Is Ninjitsu like Krav Maga ...?"

no.



"...practical, natural, effective, no need for brute force, and fairs well in the street?"

yes.

"Also, is it a specialized type of art, ...?"

no.
unless you count specializing in natural movement and a lot of sneakiness.

"And is all this easy to learn?- http://www.geocities.com/kingsburgbu.../tenryaku.html"

yeah, most of it. The sanshin and kihon happo take a pretty long time to get the hang of, and some people have a hard time with some of the rolls. All of those things are considered bare minimum to know by shodan (black belt).


Here's some other video clips found after a quick google search:
http://kihon.com/dojo/movies.html
http://www.mizunagaredojo.com/What%20is%20Bujinkan%20Streaming%20Medium.wmv
couple short clips here too: http://www.mbdojo.com/basics.html
and here's one of Hatsumi sensei himself: http://www.sanshin.dk/files/hatsumi_taikai98.wmv

You can find this stuff yourself if you know how to look.


You're welcome.

wow, Shizen, i like it. Sorry, I just have bad luck, i seem to stumbled on the "American" version of ninjitsu. Apperantly everyone discourages that, sooo....
ps.Thanks!

 

[Lobo]

Question: If there no accuarate picture of Ninjitsu, what should i study? What is there to study? what are the different styles of Bujinkan, and why is there so much debate over which is the bset or authentic?

 

[Koinu]

Question: If there no accuarate picture of Ninjitsu, what should i study?

The lessons of the day as presented by a good instructor who trains under Hatsumi sensei and the Shihan if you want to train in the Bujinkan because they have the closest thing to this picture you seek. Until you become skilled enough to start to study the real questions at hand , that being the study of ones self and how we interact with nature. What is there to study everything about yourself, nature and human beings. All the techinques you will learn in a good dojo are only tools to teach you this understanding of yourself and nature.

What is there to study?

Planet earth and everything that walks, grows or crawls opon it and earths place in the universe and how all interact with each other.Most of us however are still stuck on just learning how to use our bodies in a correct manner like new born babies finding such joy and wonderment at being able to wiggle our fingers.

what are the different styles of Bujinkan,

There is only one style of Bujinkan in this generation,Hatsumi sensei's style!
Everything else inculding that of the good instructors in just their version of what Soke is teaching.

and why is there so much debate over which is the best or authentic?

EGO! $ ! Closed minds ! Full cups! People wanting to reject the reality and subsitute their own about what real Martial arts are.

On criticism look for the lesson in it instead of taking offence to the words when it comes from good people, otherwise good people may not bother next time and that is always the loss of the reciever not the person who takes the time and effort to show you how to correct your mistakes.

 

[Connovar]

I would strongly suggest you pick up a copy of Lt. Col David Grossmans work ON COMBAT:The Psychology and Physiology of Deadly Conflict in War and Peace first. Its a very readable and enjoyable summarization of what is required to make an effective warrior whether upon city streets or modern warfare. It is based upon objective science not myth or tradition. Read it. Visit various schools and see how they fit with the research and make up your own mind. While not focused on martial arts it focuses on warriorship mentally, physiologically and tactically. Good luck in your quest!

 

[Lobo]

I would strongly suggest you pick up a copy of Lt. Col David Grossmans work ON COMBAT:The Psychology and Physiology of Deadly Conflict in War and Peace first. Its a very readable and enjoyable summarization of what is required to make an effective warrior whether upon city streets or modern warfare. It is based upon objective science not myth or tradition. Read it. Visit various schools and see how they fit with the research and make up your own mind. While not focused on martial arts it focuses on warriorship mentally, physiologically and tactically. Good luck in your quest!

THank you connovar, i will. oh, and thank you too Koinu. **laughs** ..wiggle your fingers

 

[MJS]

I dont know if i should start it or not. Originally, i wanted to do Krav Maga, mainly because its practical street fighting, and eskrima (because Krav maga can help me disable, while eskrima could help me use opponents weapon against him effectively) but a friend said Ninjitsu is very effective. I looked and looked but i couldn't find an accurate picture of Ninjitsu/Bujinkan. I dont know if its the corny ninja stuff, or if its actually effective. Is Ninjitsu like Krav Maga (check videos for awesome clips)?: practical, natural, effective, no need for brute force, and fairs well in the street? I personally believe there is no use for swords at the momment, becuase no one is going to use a sword in the street, but its always good to learn. Is it a fancy Krav? I know what it is (history), i just dont know what it is...:idunno: please help, and fast!
-Thank you,
K

You may want to check this out:

http://www.winjutsu.com/

It would probably be best for you to check out a school in person. You'll get a much better feel for what this art is like.

Mike

 

[Deaf]

Lobo,

You currently list ShotoKan as your art within your profile. If this is the case then you do have some martial art experience to be able to make a decision such as this.

Where are you located at? You're best bet is really to go visit a reputable Bujinkan dojo and a reputable Krav dojo and then make your decision from there. I will say that out of my 20+ years martial art career, the Bujinkan is a very well rounded and effective system to me.

All in all, it is ultimately going to be your choice and decision. We can tell you all about our opinions til we are blue in the face, however ultimately it is going to be your first impression going into a reputable dojo that is going to help you make this decision.

I wish you good luck in your endeavor.

 

[Lobo]

yes, i have some experience. i stopped, a long time ago, but i stil remeber some things. I lost the feel. And i'am trying to find a dojo. I'm still deciding, though.

 

[Deaf]

Well if you give us an area where you are located, we may be able to help you find a reputable Bujinkan dojo that you can check out.