harlan
2nd Black Belt
Simple question: how much does the sense of obligation determine your attendance/training?
Obligations
- Thread starter harlan
- Start date
allenjp
Brown Belt
Not a whole lot, but it does. In fact that's kinda why I signed up...
It should influence it alot but in today world, sorry here it comes. We have no sense of obligation towards anything let alone a MA. The thought is for the most part I am paying so why does it matter, well only the true student not practitionars are still obligated.
FearlessFreep
Senior Master
Very, very little. I don't go because I feel obligated, I go because that's where I want to be and what I want to do.
allenjp
Brown Belt
I agree with you Terry, my thing is that I have other obligations (namely two small boys and a wife) that have to play first fiddle. For example, my wife got a bad sinus infection last week, and as much as I felt my obligation to go to class, my obligation to stay home and cook dinner and take care of the kids so my wife could rest was more important...
I have a wife and three boys I do understand, but since I own my school i have to be here.
allenjp
Brown Belt
Oh...well of course that changes things. Do you do that full time or do you have another job?
I am semi retire for the last six years, my wife is a school teacher and this year I am going back to teaching and then run the school at night only.
jkembry
Black Belt
Obligated...nah...Too many other things going on in life that have to be shuffled and re-shuffled that are true obligations. Family, work...etc. Perhaps as I get older...and can advance...I will be able to take more of the bits and pieces and make them part of my everyday life to help deal with other obligations as they happen.
ktaylor75
Orange Belt
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2007
- Messages
- 84
- Reaction score
- 5
My only 2 obligations in life are to God and family. When I tend to those, everything else seems to just fall into place. I am merely a student in Kenpo, without having signed a contract...I train because I love it, not out of obligation.
A sense of obligation, responsibility or duty is one of the great spiritual virtues that a student of the martial arts should be seeking to improve.
My teacher is going out of his way to instruct me in something rare and worthy of preservation and is doing so out of his own sense of obligation to the art rather than to make money. The least I can do is match his committment.
My teacher is going out of his way to instruct me in something rare and worthy of preservation and is doing so out of his own sense of obligation to the art rather than to make money. The least I can do is match his committment.
When I was a just a student I was purely motivated by my enjoyment - I wanted to be there because it was fun and I never knew what I might miss by not being there. If I felt crappy or something and knew I wouldn't enjoy the training that class then I wouldn't go - but that was an incredibly rare situation.
As an instructor, I don't have that convenience. There are times when I'm out of town or have some sort of familial obligation and I know in advance so I have one of my senior students cover class. But if I feel like crap or didn't get enough sleep or whatever at the last minute then I feel obligated to go because I don't know that anyone can cover for me and I don't want to inconvenience any of my students unnecessarily by calling them at the last minute - unless there's some sort of emergency, of course.
Mike
Hey harlan
Yes, I always felt an obligation to my first instructor. Not because he demanded it. Not because I paid for it. I felt the obligation because I truly liked the man. And I respected him greatly and valued his teaching. The sense of obligation was entirely self-imposed, simply because I thought I owed him a 100% attendance and I thought he deserved it. It was so plain that he had great concern for me and for his students. He cared, and so we cared too . I know he would have taught us for nothing. Also I hate letting anyone down.. sorry I know that is not very coherent..Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna
CoryKS
Senior Master
Very much. If not for my obligations - family, work, etc. - I would attend more classes.
shihansmurf
Black Belt
Interesting question.
I suppose it would depend upon to whom I felt the obligation.
As a student I have no obligations to my instructor other than to pay calss tuition and be polite during class. That's it. I'm the customer, he is providing the service. He teachec, I pay for class. End of transaction. No obligation.
As a teacher I have an obligation to provide effective coaching in a safe enviornment. I teach, the student pays tuition. End of transaction. No obligation.
If I had a personal interest in the student it would change the dynamic, but only slightly. I think it is important to compartmentalize a bit.
U;timately it is all about priorities. I simply don't think that I endevor under any sort of fealty to practice my hobby. I don't incur any real obligation to play video games or cook italian food, two other interests I have, so why would karate be any different?
Mark
I suppose it would depend upon to whom I felt the obligation.
As a student I have no obligations to my instructor other than to pay calss tuition and be polite during class. That's it. I'm the customer, he is providing the service. He teachec, I pay for class. End of transaction. No obligation.
As a teacher I have an obligation to provide effective coaching in a safe enviornment. I teach, the student pays tuition. End of transaction. No obligation.
If I had a personal interest in the student it would change the dynamic, but only slightly. I think it is important to compartmentalize a bit.
U;timately it is all about priorities. I simply don't think that I endevor under any sort of fealty to practice my hobby. I don't incur any real obligation to play video games or cook italian food, two other interests I have, so why would karate be any different?
Mark
If I tell someone I will be somewhere at a certain time, then I have an obligation to either show up or let the person know I will be late or not present at all. This is courtesy. The nature of the event does not matter - a martial arts class, meeting a friend to hang out, going to work, showing up at the doctor's office, whatever. I know a lot of people don't feel that way - they show up at MA class because they paid for it; they meet friends or don't depending on how they feel at the moment; they work for the money and nothing else; they show up at the doctor's office or call because there's a fee if you don't show and don't call...
Let's look at that last one. So many people don't show, or don't call, that they actually have to charge you if you don't show or call, to force you to be courteous to the doctor, the office staff, and anyone else who might need the appointment. That this is a norm in this society disturbs me.
So yes, when I am going to work out and I can't make it - I call my sahbum. When I'm going to teach and I can't make it, I make arrangements for a sub; in an emergency, when coverage isn't possible or class is canceled due to weather or other problems, I contact every student personally and let them know. I find courtesy to be an obligation, yes... but I don't limit it to TKD, either; it's part of who I am.
Let's look at that last one. So many people don't show, or don't call, that they actually have to charge you if you don't show or call, to force you to be courteous to the doctor, the office staff, and anyone else who might need the appointment. That this is a norm in this society disturbs me.
So yes, when I am going to work out and I can't make it - I call my sahbum. When I'm going to teach and I can't make it, I make arrangements for a sub; in an emergency, when coverage isn't possible or class is canceled due to weather or other problems, I contact every student personally and let them know. I find courtesy to be an obligation, yes... but I don't limit it to TKD, either; it's part of who I am.
ppko
Master Black Belt
So very true I am big on people calling me and to tell you the truth I have never had a problem where people wouldn't call if they cant show up. Its common courtesy this way I know how many people will be there in return I make sure to always have someone teaching if I cant make it.
Hey Mark
I think you are exactly right insofar as this is how martial arts tuition is conducted these days and but I think it is a shame. You have implied a certain aloofness there or dispassion?? Akin to a professional business relationship. When I taught I did develop a compassion for students that was of itself a certain binding to me. Again, I tried not to expect it back and but funny how these things engender reciprocation.. and but maybe that is just me I only taught for a while and have no great claim on expertise Yr most obdt hmble srvt,
Jenna
kidswarrior
Senior Master
Skn highlights something I believe we're missing here: teaching is not an all/nothing thing. It's a continuum along which are measured effort, passion, and knowledge--and probably much more. As a professional teacher, I know of some colleagues who are RIP (retired in place). They go through the motions, but have no passion for what or who they teach. So they're 'teaching', but at a minimal level. I would not want to be in such a class, and certainly wouldn't attend an after-hours class in MA taught in such a way.
And Jenna brings us to the karmic part. As teachers, we get back what we put out. How could it be any different for students? In other words, if someone sees me in a purely selfish, business-oriented light, I'm going to give him his money's worth, but probably not much more. But see, I believe the arts are worth very much more than the market would ever bear to charge, as they were when my teachers taught me. So giving someone their money's worth is never going to require my all. Only my own passion to propagate the Arts as I believe they should be done, will cause me to do that. And if I must choose, I'm going to save my all for those who share my passion.Jenna said:
Deaf Smith
Master of Arts
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2008
- Messages
- 1,722
- Reaction score
- 85
To an extent it does determine my attendence, but not my training. My teacher has been having hard times for the last few years, personal and financial. I'd hate to leave him in the lurch so far as paying dues and attending at least one class a week I do.
But, training? Oh, no. No way.
I train hard in what I consider is the best methods and strategy for me. Some of what I get from TKD and SBD is, well, dated. Some is what I consider totaly useless on the street. And thus I explore other arts to fill in the gaps. Cause it's what goes on in the street that matters the most to me. The martial arts are wonderful, but if the method is not 'street worthy', I just go through the motions to satisfy others. It won't be in my toolbox when the gong sounds.
Deaf
