Need help from the TKD'ists out there

[seninoniwashi]

Hiya all, I'm from the other side of the board here looking for help from all you TKD'ist. Being from a Kenpo background and not being used to high or repetitive kicks I’m having a terrible time with my hamstrings.

I just recently started taking a TKD class to build on my kicking skills and I am finding my hamstrings so sore I can barely walk the next day. It seems like no matter how much I stretch before and after class I’m still sore.

My classes are twice a week and recently they’ve been only once a week because of my slow healing. Anyone out there have any ideas other then stretching as to how to quickly recover my hamstrings or any preventive measures I could take?

 

[Jai]

try ice and or heat afterwards for up to an hour after classes. I was say once a week would be good until your legs get use to the kicking. Most of all don't give up. Once your leg muscles break down and start to rebuild you will find the going much easier.

 

[foot2face]

Jai is right on the mark. After class ice your hamstrings in order to reduce inflammation and swelling. The following days continually heat and massage your legs, this will increase circulation and aid in healing. You should consider investing in a high quality protein shake. The kind weight lifters consume. The principal behind gaining flexibility by stretching is similar to gain strength through resistance training. Consuming a protein shake after class or an intense stretching routine will boost recovery. Also don't focus so much on stretching before class rather focus on warming up. Your goal should be to gradually elevate your heart rate and raise your core temperature. The increased blood flow and heat will limber you up and protect your muscles much more than just preforming stretches cold. Finally, remember to get plenty of rest, that is when you will heal.

 

[Bret Hinds]

Try some exercise on making your hamstrings stronger,dips and cross walks also check your shoes. Shoes sized wrong will amp up the pain on sore legs, calf etc. use heat tiger balm hot water etc. for pre-work outs All the best in the arts

 

[Kacey]

Stretch after class - stretching/calisthenics before class are intended to loosen up and warm the muscles to prevent injury; to improve your flexibility you need to stretch when your muscles are warm and loose.

Also, as soon as possible after class, lay on your back with your legs up a wall (get your tailbone as close to the wall as possible) for 10-15 minutes. It looks really silly, but it helps the fatigue poisons to drain from your muscles instead of building up; along with a cool-down stretch, this will help reduce the soreness you feel the next day.

 

[KEritano]

What others have recommended is very good. I'd also make sure to drink plenty of fluids before, after and during training. And I'd stretch EVERY day, maybe even twice a day.

If you are taking vitamin supplements, have you ever tried amino acids? They helpeme recover from intense workouts.

If it is taking you an week to recover from a workout, then you may be working too hard ... over stressing the muscles and maybe your joints. You should be able to workout 3x/week. If this is the case, then you may need to reduce the number of repetitions initially and gradually build up. Your body will thank you in the long run.

 

[seninoniwashi]

Many thanks to all who have provided feedback; I knew you were the folks to ask I'm gonna approach this coming week a little different.

 

[exile]

Two additional ideas:

• It's very important to stretch before you kick, but static stretches aren't the way to go. Instead, use dynamic stretches: controlled rear-leg stretch kicks, for example, with rapid non-ballistic elevations of your rear leg to the front, with no bend in the knee at all—this is very important—and side versions of the same kick. Thomas Kurz uses these dynamic stretch kicks the basis of his stretch training, and I've had very good results with them.

• There is a very good dynamic exercise I've been experimenting with using not a full kicking range, but rather up/down reps involving a chambered kicking leg, as described and discussed in this thread. As I suggested in the thread, this exercise trains balance, strength and flexibility simultaneously, and can be ramped up to any degree of difficulty you like. For example, after doing ten reps, come back to the position where the chambered leg is `up', fire three roundhouse kicks in succession off the same chamber, come back to the chambered position, and then thrust the kicking leg out in a side kick, hard, hold it for twenty seconds at full extention in perfect balance, then come back to chamber and return to the fighting stance. Obviously, you want to work your way up to this level, but if you take it in small increments, you should find your hamstrings getting much more resilient and flexible, in a fairly sort time—a few months will see a marked improvement.

Muscle soreness is to be expected; any time you overload the tendons in a given muscle group, you're going to get delayed onset muscle soreness, no matter how experienced you are. When you're first starting these sorts of kicks, you're going to be doing that on a pretty constant basis. If you keep working on the kicks, and the backup exercises for them, though, you'll find that over the course of a few months the level of discomfort will go way, way down.

 

[newGuy12]

Yes! Things have changed a lot since the 1970's! I don't mean to say that the old ways are really bad, but science progresses, and this includes the science that exercise is based on!

I am now using the Elastic Steel method (Paul Zaichik -- the poor man's Tom Kurz?). And, with his method you also see that there is a way to stretch that is better than the old fashioned way of starting out with the static stretches while cold, or the ballistic stretches while cold -- the latter is actually dangerous!

Zaichik advises the user to start with joint rotations -- roll the head in the neck, swing the arms to rotate the shoulders, twist the waist, roll the waist, roll the knees, bend the knees, roll the ankles. These are easy exercises, and they serve to lubricate the joints (get the synovial fluid coating the bones).

Then, you do some aerobic activity to warm up -- stay in the normal range of motion, do not "go for it" with high kicks yet.

Next, he does some light stretches, to waken the nervous system and prepare the muscles for action. These mostly comprise a full body general stretching routine.

Then, he does the "mobility swings". These are the motions that Exile described above:

Instead, use dynamic stretches: controlled rear-leg stretch kicks, for example, with rapid non-ballistic elevations of your rear leg to the front, with no bend in the knee at all—this is very important—and side versions of the same kick. Thomas Kurz uses these dynamic stretch kicks the basis of his stretch training, and I've had very good results with them.

Next, he moves to STRENGTH exercises. You must make the muscles (as well as the connective tissue) strong enough to be used in the extended range. So, the strength exercises are important!

Then, he uses the "static chambering" poses as described by Exile, except that he has you hold the chambered leg without kicking. Instead, the knee traces out a circle in the air. Once exercise is the chamber for the roundhouse kick, one is for the front kick.

Then, Zaichik instructs us to kick the leg and hold it OUT. First in the roundhouse motion. While holding it out, the foot then traces a circle. Go ahead and move the leg about. Then, do it for the front kick. I also try the side kick.

Then, more swings, but from a position with the feet together, and the terminal position will be equal to the final position that a kick would have. Do it for each: front kick, side kick. Then, chamber for the roundhouse kick and extend.

Finally, he goes into DEEP STRETCHES. A series of stretches to really gain range with the front splits and the side splits.

Now, I apologize if I have been too wordy. I wanted to give an overview of Paul Zaichik's way, because I am excited about it. Kurz is fine, and highly respected. Exile cites him. The only thing is, Kurz's work seems to be more general, to be all things to all people. This confuses me! I am ONLY a martial arts student, I do not play other sports. Zaichik, on the other hand, does not describe multiple paths of exercise. No. He lays out just one plan!

In any event, I will say this: The main thing is, try to not pull any connective tissue! Muscle pulls are one thing, but tendons are another! If you persist, and practice daily, you will achieve great flexibility, and strength. I know this, because it has happened for me before, and is happening again now!




High Regards,

Robert

 

[exile]

In any event, I will say this: The main thing is, try to not pull any connective tissue! Muscle pulls are one thing, but tendons are another! If you persist, and practice daily, you will achieve great flexibility, and strength. I know this, because it has happened for me before, and is happening again now!

Goooooood post, Robert—you're still on my rep stack, so I won't be able to hit you for a little while yet, but hope to before The Curtain Drops—but the most important thing is what I've cited from your preceding post. Connective tissue is the weak link in the skelatal/muscular connection (connective tissue weakness faced with chemically induced muscle hypertrophy is the number one reason so many pro bodybuilders retire due to major injuries, most spectacularly Dorian Yates a couple of Mr. Olympias ago—no matter how big the muscles get under the artificial stimulus of anabolic substances, the tendons, ligaments, cartilige etc is unaffected, so their work just gets harder to perform as the bodybuilder blows up like a protein balloon...). And a bone injury is as a rule far easier to fix than serious connective tissue damage, which often involves pins, wires, restringing the joint with bits and pieces from other parts of your body.... So caution and gradual progress have got to be the watchwords. The chap you mention sounds well worth reading—thanks for the information!