mechanics, attributes, tactics. that's it?

[twinkletoes]

In a conversation with Mr. Roy Harris, he told me he divides training into 3 compartments:

Mechanics (the proper delivery of a move; the correct body action in a "technique")

Attributes (the qualities that fuel your techniques, like speed, strength, etc.)

Tactics (the ability to employ them at the appropriate time/distance for effective use)

It seems to me that he is correct: all training breaks down, one way or another, into these three compartments. Certainly many training methods overlap--you can build attributes while training mechanics, for example. But it does seem that this is it. Is there anything else?

Also, here's a list of attributes I have been thinking about. Are there other attributes you need?

Physical:

Speed
Strength
Explosiveness
Timing
Coordination
Balance
Distancing
Footwork
Reaction Speed
Endurance
Stamina
Sensitivity

Mental:

Pain Tolerance
Concentration
Focus
Awareness
Determination
Aggressiveness
Clarity


~TT

 

[pesilat]

Read the article "Diamond in the Rough" that I have at my website: http://impactacademy.com/articles

It discusses my perception of "proper relaxation." Proper relaxatoin is, to me, the key that makes those attributes work - and it's what you're trying to develop while you're working on those attributes you listed. It's like the forest and the attributes you listed are the trees that comprise it.

For me, things boil down, basically, to two elements: proper relaxatoin and strategy.

Proper relaxation embodies all the physical and mental attributes that really make the material work. Strategy is "where and when to employ those tools to use them to their best advantage."

But, as usual, it's really just a different way of saying the same thing. He says, "toe-may-toe" and I say, "toe-ma-toe" - but we're talking about the same reddish orange fruit/vegetable thingamajiggy (how's that for an explanation )

Mike

 

[twinkletoes]

Mike,

I read your article. You touch on some good ideas: positioning and stategy are key elements for efficiency. Avoiding excess tension in the body helps flow and awareness.

I think maybe your article suggests that "composure" should be on my attribute list. I agree. I think it also suggests that some form of "muscular relaxation" should be there. I am inclined to say so, but I think it may be covered by some other things.

For example, if you are overly tense, what does that do? For starters, it cuts down on endurance. It limits sensitivity and mobility. It diminishes stamina. These are attributes already listed.

However, I like your suggestion of relaxation as it has extrinsic value relating to these. That makes it important to work on. I think that belongs on the list.

Your post seems to imply that there is no place for mechanics or other attribute training. I don't think you meant that, I think it's just how I'm reading it. If you did mean that, we should talk. That would be crazy. Otherwise, thanks for your post

~TT

 

[pesilat]

Originally posted by twinkletoes
Mike,

For example, if you are overly tense, what does that do? For starters, it cuts down on endurance. It limits sensitivity and mobility. It diminishes stamina. These are attributes already listed.

Yup. My "proper relaxation" concept is kind of macrocosmic. Those are elements/attributes that are components of the larger concept of "proper relaxation."

Your post seems to imply that there is no place for mechanics or other attribute training. I don't think you meant that, I think it's just how I'm reading it. If you did mean that, we should talk. That would be crazy. Otherwise, thanks for your post

Yup. That would be crazy. No, mechanics and attribute training are, in my perception, part of the larger idea of "proper relaxation"

Mike

 

[twinkletoes]

Mike,

So perhaps with your view, we could say that composure under fire is a result of:

1) confidence in your mechanics and attribute training

2) working on specifically developing composure and relaxation in dynamic and chaotic training environments

Does that sound right?


I agree that composure is an important attribute, because it contributes to awareness and proper use of tactics. Additionally, muscular relaxation will allow for good sensitivity.

However, I do not agree that this is the main ingredient, or overriding attribute. I think that sometimes composed and relaxed fighters (Minotauro, Royce Gracie, and many others) often meet their match when they come up against an opponent who has them outmatched in regards to other attributes (strength, speed, etc.). Sometimes they can also just be "out-strategized" or run up against an opponent with superior knowledge.

I have a feeling this will just be a "agree to disagree" kind of point.

Best,

~TT

 

[pesilat]

Originally posted by twinkletoes
Mike,

So perhaps with your view, we could say that composure under fire is a result of:

1) confidence in your mechanics and attribute training

2) working on specifically developing composure and relaxation in dynamic and chaotic training environments

Does that sound right?

Yup. That sounds right.

I agree that composure is an important attribute, because it contributes to awareness and proper use of tactics. Additionally, muscular relaxation will allow for good sensitivity.

However, I do not agree that this is the main ingredient, or overriding attribute. I think that sometimes composed and relaxed fighters (Minotauro, Royce Gracie, and many others) often meet their match when they come up against an opponent who has them outmatched in regards to other attributes (strength, speed, etc.). Sometimes they can also just be "out-strategized" or run up against an opponent with superior knowledge.

I have a feeling this will just be a "agree to disagree" kind of point.

Best,

~TT

Not having seen any of the fights you mentioned, I can't comment. But I can relate to what you're talking about.

Personally, I think "proper relaxation" is a "key" - not necessarily the main ingredient or overriding attribute. In my estimation, it's a "key" that helps unlock the potential of the other attributes such as strength and speed; helps one to take full advantage of what those attributes provide.

On the subject of fighting - the person who's best (at the time of the fight) with his/her tools (regardless of which tools are used) will have the advantage. Everyone has good days and bad days, and there's always someone better

My point about proper relaxation is that it's a very important aspect because of the support structure that it provides for all the other attributes. The other attributes shouldn't be neglected. But developing proper relaxation can help the other attributes reach higher levels of functionality.

Mike

 

[arnisador]

Sound a lot like the JKD approach to fighting!

 

[Old Fat Kenpoka]

In Renzo Gracie's Mastering Ju Jitsu book he sites three factors:

Concepts (Knowing how and when to apply techniques)
Techniques (individual movements and combinations designed to improve position, hit targets, gain submission)
Attributes (conditioning, training, etc).

Great thread so far.

 

[andurilking2]

Experience

 

[twinkletoes]

Experience is good, but can you elaborate?

My initial thought is that those with more experience generally manifest their advantage through better awareness, timing, positioning, and are therefore more efficient.

What other benefits does experience bring to the table? (I really hesitate to say that experience has any intrinsic value for our purposes).

~TT

 

[arnisador]

The Mastering JuJitsu book has a lot of good stuff in it--also a lot of boring, repetitive stuff up front.