Wudang108
White Belt
Can anyone provide evidence for this claim: "Finally, in 2005, at the age of 80, Grandmaster Ma came out of retirement to compete in an international fighting tournament. He won first place and beat his competitor, the president of the Ukrainian Fighting Association, who, at 30 years old, was fifty years younger than Grandmaster Ma."
I personally have trouble believing this claim because I've watched the scant video that does exist for Ma Jie and I have trouble believing it. Compared to other descendants of Li Jinglin, Ma Jie seems to lack the footwork, balance and real internal technique that would presumably be a requirement for anyone beating anyone competent, much less an 80 year-old vs. a competent 30 year old.
I've also never heard of anyone engaging in a fighting competition at that age. Mayweather and Pacquiao were considered old for boxing in their late 30's. Even greatest-of-all-timers like Kimura, where everything is documented, had his last fight at 42 against the 27 year old Santana who outweighted him by 40 lbs.
Real masters stop fighting when it's no longer safe or viable because any legit martial master is a realist. I'm a recognized Wudang master from a lineage that is actually documented I'll go toe-to-toe with anyone in my 50's and tire them out because I train more, but that still doesn't mean I could take Tyson in a fair or unfair fight. And pretty much every 30 year-old who is not a weakling is Tyson to pretty much any 80 year old.
I do not believe this claim. I've spoken to a few actual Taoist wudang masters with legit internal technique and was advised that most of the taoist teachers are opportunists if not outright frauds.
That's one of the main drivers for the secular art that comes down from Li Jinglin, which influences all modern Wudang. The secular art is the more widely practiced, by several orders of magnitude, than the old fashioned taoist arts, and therefore, just by basic evolutionary mechanisms, has to be stronger in its modern development, just by sheer weight of numbers. Secret societies were not a good thing for the arts, when we compare to the success of modern arts with full transparency like Judo.
The secular art comes through the military apparatus and had to be practical for real use in the Republican Era. Taoists specifically lived in the wilderness to avoid involvement in politics and with the government.
I personally have trouble believing this claim because I've watched the scant video that does exist for Ma Jie and I have trouble believing it. Compared to other descendants of Li Jinglin, Ma Jie seems to lack the footwork, balance and real internal technique that would presumably be a requirement for anyone beating anyone competent, much less an 80 year-old vs. a competent 30 year old.
I've also never heard of anyone engaging in a fighting competition at that age. Mayweather and Pacquiao were considered old for boxing in their late 30's. Even greatest-of-all-timers like Kimura, where everything is documented, had his last fight at 42 against the 27 year old Santana who outweighted him by 40 lbs.
Real masters stop fighting when it's no longer safe or viable because any legit martial master is a realist. I'm a recognized Wudang master from a lineage that is actually documented I'll go toe-to-toe with anyone in my 50's and tire them out because I train more, but that still doesn't mean I could take Tyson in a fair or unfair fight. And pretty much every 30 year-old who is not a weakling is Tyson to pretty much any 80 year old.
I do not believe this claim. I've spoken to a few actual Taoist wudang masters with legit internal technique and was advised that most of the taoist teachers are opportunists if not outright frauds.
That's one of the main drivers for the secular art that comes down from Li Jinglin, which influences all modern Wudang. The secular art is the more widely practiced, by several orders of magnitude, than the old fashioned taoist arts, and therefore, just by basic evolutionary mechanisms, has to be stronger in its modern development, just by sheer weight of numbers. Secret societies were not a good thing for the arts, when we compare to the success of modern arts with full transparency like Judo.
The secular art comes through the military apparatus and had to be practical for real use in the Republican Era. Taoists specifically lived in the wilderness to avoid involvement in politics and with the government.
