Help Choosing a Martial Art?

[AriesKai]

Hello to you all and thank you for taking the time to read/answer my question!


I am interested in a specific "style", if you will, that includes a group of various different techniques that I would like to apply in self defense situations.

I will begin with what i've already looked into, and please, do not take offense to my expression of opinion. I have my tastes and likings that differ to others.


I have looked into Ninjutsu. I liked many of the things that I saw in Ninjutsu, primarily the Taijutsu techniques, the evasion techniques, and the knife offense/defense techniques.

What I did not like about Ninjutsu, is that practitioners have to practice with swords and other types of weapons that I probably wouldn't find immediately ready for me - given that I am confronted by a couple of thugs as i'm passing by, walking through the park or down the wrong street.
Also, I did not find a good school near me in the Dallas area that was with Genbukan.


These are the techniques that I find useful for myself in a fight:

1.) Strikes to the throat, eyegouges, eyerakes, biting, headbutting, strikes to the groin, strikes to vital parts of the head, strikes to vital parts of the entire body.

2.) The use of hands, elbows, knees, AND feet.

3.) Great takedowns and at least SOME emphasis on grappling techniques. Also a good emphasis on ground-work (at least enough to be able to get back up on your feet. I would hate to bite the boot of another attacker while i'm wrestling/BJJ'ing around on the ground with his buddy.).

4.) Weapon defense techniques. Knife and gun disarms (whoever actually uses a gun up close probably shouldn't have a gun in their hands in the first place. they were designed for attacking an opponent/enemy at DISTANCES. Nevertheless, you still have the untrained "killers".), disarms with sticks and baseball bats.

5.) Evasion techniques. I think the best way to win a fight is to completely avoid one or get the hell out of it. It saves someone a big hospital bill and injuries, and/or having to pay money to post bond to get their butts out of jail.

6.) Good, strong stance(s).


I think that's the jist of it.
Note, everybody: I am going to be straight forward with you. Once I get into the fight, I do not care about the person I am fighting. What I know, is that I have to take them down or out fast, effectively, and as accurately as all possible. I don't care how much pain I will cause them. I don't know about other states, but in the state of Texas, if you are assaulted and you end up hospitalizing the criminal - tough **** on him! You more than likely will NOT be arrested. I'd highly recommend witnesses, though! Somehow, I have been in situations where I have called the police after coming out on top in a fight, and I have not been arrested once.
Remember everybody, like I said before: If I can avoid the fight, I already feel that I won. Does that make me a coward? Absolutely not.

Anyways, sorry about all of the irrelevant information.


I am only looking for ideas on which martial art would probably best suit me. I am only looking for the professional opinion of others (not their personal opinion, no offense).
If you're studying or have studied a particular martial art that you would like to recommend for me to try; please do so now!


Thank you all!



PS: I think some good information to add are a couple of details about myself. I am 22 years old. I am a little overweight (30% body fat). I am 6'1 and weigh about 235lbs.
Anything else you'd like to know to help you answer this question, I will be glad to answer!

Aries Kai

 

[Carol]

There are Filipino systems that incorporate all of that. The ground work is generally dumog and not BJJ, unless you have a teacher that is incorporating BJJ in to their system (which is possible). There is a lot more weapons work in FMA systems (typically stick and knife), so I am not sure if that is something you are interested in or not.

American Kenpo typically incorporates most of what you are looking for, but without the ground work. Jeff Speakman's Kenpo 5.0 incorporates a lot of ground training, some other teachers add it on as an adjunct, or in a separate class for their students who are interested.

Your size or weight shouldn't be a factor for either style, a good instructor will not insist that a beginner will be in great shape...and instead will work with the student with what s/he has to offer and help them get in better shape.

 

[blindsage]

Filipino systems with dumog or other ground fighting as Carol said.
Kenpo as well, or Kajukenbo.
Krav Maga
Sambo
Systema
Some Japanese Jujitsu
A good number of kung fu styles will meet much of what you are looking for depending on the teacher and their methods.
Silat

 

[Blindside]

Arts are important, but instructors are more so. I agree with Carol's post and would point you over to:

http://www.ptkgo.com/PTKGO/Instructors.html

Dallas/Ft. Worth has one of the higher concentrations of Pekiti instructors in the nation.

 

[MJS]

Hello to you all and thank you for taking the time to read/answer my question!


I am interested in a specific "style", if you will, that includes a group of various different techniques that I would like to apply in self defense situations.

I will begin with what i've already looked into, and please, do not take offense to my expression of opinion. I have my tastes and likings that differ to others.


I have looked into Ninjutsu. I liked many of the things that I saw in Ninjutsu, primarily the Taijutsu techniques, the evasion techniques, and the knife offense/defense techniques.

What I did not like about Ninjutsu, is that practitioners have to practice with swords and other types of weapons that I probably wouldn't find immediately ready for me - given that I am confronted by a couple of thugs as i'm passing by, walking through the park or down the wrong street.
Also, I did not find a good school near me in the Dallas area that was with Genbukan.


These are the techniques that I find useful for myself in a fight:

1.) Strikes to the throat, eyegouges, eyerakes, biting, headbutting, strikes to the groin, strikes to vital parts of the head, strikes to vital parts of the entire body.

2.) The use of hands, elbows, knees, AND feet.

3.) Great takedowns and at least SOME emphasis on grappling techniques. Also a good emphasis on ground-work (at least enough to be able to get back up on your feet. I would hate to bite the boot of another attacker while i'm wrestling/BJJ'ing around on the ground with his buddy.).

4.) Weapon defense techniques. Knife and gun disarms (whoever actually uses a gun up close probably shouldn't have a gun in their hands in the first place. they were designed for attacking an opponent/enemy at DISTANCES. Nevertheless, you still have the untrained "killers".), disarms with sticks and baseball bats.

5.) Evasion techniques. I think the best way to win a fight is to completely avoid one or get the hell out of it. It saves someone a big hospital bill and injuries, and/or having to pay money to post bond to get their butts out of jail.

6.) Good, strong stance(s).


I think that's the jist of it.
Note, everybody: I am going to be straight forward with you. Once I get into the fight, I do not care about the person I am fighting. What I know, is that I have to take them down or out fast, effectively, and as accurately as all possible. I don't care how much pain I will cause them. I don't know about other states, but in the state of Texas, if you are assaulted and you end up hospitalizing the criminal - tough **** on him! You more than likely will NOT be arrested. I'd highly recommend witnesses, though! Somehow, I have been in situations where I have called the police after coming out on top in a fight, and I have not been arrested once.
Remember everybody, like I said before: If I can avoid the fight, I already feel that I won. Does that make me a coward? Absolutely not.

Anyways, sorry about all of the irrelevant information.


I am only looking for ideas on which martial art would probably best suit me. I am only looking for the professional opinion of others (not their personal opinion, no offense).
If you're studying or have studied a particular martial art that you would like to recommend for me to try; please do so now!


Thank you all!



PS: I think some good information to add are a couple of details about myself. I am 22 years old. I am a little overweight (30% body fat). I am 6'1 and weigh about 235lbs.
Anything else you'd like to know to help you answer this question, I will be glad to answer!

Aries Kai

So, I take it by this post, that you still havent found something to train in yet? Looking at your posting history, back in '09, you were asking numerous questions about various arts, as well as getting pretty upset with many of the replies that you received. I can only hope that this thread doesnt take the same turn.

 

[Hawke]

Here's a sticky that Kacey put together:
http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47497

Go visit your neighborhood schools. A realistic driving distance that only you know. Especially days when you do not feel like training.

Meet with the instructors. Remember back in school when you had a terrible teacher? Learning was a pain (not in a good way). Then there were the awesome teachers that just knew how to communicate their ideas to the class. Learning may have been a lot of hard work, but totally worth the effort. You may be exposed to an art you never seriously considered before.

Some offer a free class or two to help you get a feel for the art and how the instructor teaches. You also get a feel for class chemistry with the other students.

If you go with a closed mind and clenched fist then there is nothing to teach, because you already know everything. If you go with an open mind and open hands then there will be many opportunities to learn and enjoy the journey.

 

[AriesKai]

So, I take it by this post, that you still havent found something to train in yet? Looking at your posting history, back in '09, you were asking numerous questions about various arts, as well as getting pretty upset with many of the replies that you received. I can only hope that this thread doesnt take the same turn.

Well, that was back in '09, just as you said! Certainly you must know, things change as people learn from their mistakes.
I will assume to disregard this comment. No offense, but I find this comment of yours irrelevant to anything that I asked.

Thanks, MJS.

 

[MJS]

Well, that was back in '09, just as you said! Certainly you must know, things change as people learn from their mistakes.
I will assume to disregard this comment. No offense, but I find this comment of yours irrelevant to anything that I asked.

Thanks, MJS.

A few things:

1) I would advise against disregarding. Why? Let this serve as a gentle warning, reminder, whatever you'd like to call it, that the incidents that happened in past post, will not be tolorated again.

2) It is relevant, because you asked the same questions back in 2009, that you're asking now.

3) Obviously you didn't learn anything from what was suggested to you in 2009, because here you are posting the exact same questions again.

One thing that has not changed, is the rules of this forum. You may want to take a look at them again. I can assure you, that we will not have a repeat performance of the BS that took place in the past.

 

[David43515]

Aries, You`re a big boy. There are lots of threads on this and other sites about what to look for when choosing a school or a style to study.

Unless you`re willing to travel great distances to study a certain style or train under a specific instructor, you`re fairly limited to what is availabe near where you live. 1) Get out your Yellow pages and see what`s available near you. 2) Look those things up on Google or come back and ask SPECIFIC questions about them. 3) Go check the schools out yourself in person and chat with the instructor and students. 4) Take a few lessons before you sign up if you can. And then make your choice.

Most styles have everything that you said you were looking for anyway. Different teachers in the same style may put more emphasis on one aspect over another, or competition more than self defense, but that`s why you want to look around.

And just a hint of advice. I`d drop the *it`s-all-about-me* attitude and learn to listen a bit more politely to people who offer you advice when you ask for it. The way you blew off MJS was immature and a bit rude.

 

[AriesKai]

A few things:

1) I would advise against disregarding. Why? Let this serve as a gentle warning, reminder, whatever you'd like to call it, that the incidents that happened in past post, will not be tolorated again.

2) It is relevant, because you asked the same questions back in 2009, that you're asking now.

3) Obviously you didn't learn anything from what was suggested to you in 2009, because here you are posting the exact same questions again.

One thing that has not changed, is the rules of this forum. You may want to take a look at them again. I can assure you, that we will not have a repeat performance of the BS that took place in the past.

Well, rather than arguing with the "forum guru" here, I am going to maintain my composure, ask questions, and disregard anything about the PAST brought up (it is the PAST, which is exactly where it should be left).
The only thing that was suggested to me last time, was Ninjutsu (as far as I can remember).
I can assure you as well, MJS, we will not have a repeat performance of the BS that took place in the past.
In my point of view, any good forum will have moderators and admins that follow the same rules as they enforce. I assume that you are a mature adult and will do as such.

Of course, I say all of this with no pun intended

I am going to disregard, despite your "warning", because any true MAN will walk away from some "internet keyboard commando flaming war". I've got better things to do with my time. If you aren't answering my questions, please quit wasting my time. If you've got something to tell me on a PERSONAL note; I suggest PM'ing me, instead of spamming this thread.


Thank you, SIR.


With Respect,
Aries Kai

 

[AriesKai]

And just a hint of advice. I`d drop the *it`s-all-about-me* attitude and learn to listen a bit more politely to people who offer you advice when you ask for it. The way you blew off MJS was immature and a bit rude.

Well, I mean no disrespect; but to me, It is all about me. I don't know any of you from adam or abel; but anyone who has relavent advice to the question asked, I am willing to listen to. I am not a Martial Arts encyclopedia, and some have more experience in the martial arts than I do.
I am not "blowing off" MJS, I am only stating that I only want the question asked. If I feel that I disagree, I will confront an individual via PM and ask them why they feel that their "philosophy" or "ideas" are correct.
MJS did not offer advice, he dug up dead bones. That is why I treated his response in the manner that I did.

I am a mature adult, not someone who has time to waste on the past.


Thanks, and as a disclaimer - I mean absolutely no disrespect.

 

[MJS]

Sir,

I'm not going to debate the forum rules with you. You're well aware of your actions in the past, and it will not be allowed to happen again. Before you find yourself banned from this forum. I strongly suggest you review the forum rules.

Consider this the final warning on the matter. Further debating/disrespect of forum staff, and the rules, will result in suspension/removal of your account.

MJS
MT Asst. Admin.

 

[AriesKai]

Sir,

I'm not going to debate the forum rules with you. You're well aware of your actions in the past, and it will not be allowed to happen again. Before you find yourself banned from this forum. I strongly suggest you review the forum rules.

Consider this the final warning on the matter. Further debating/disrespect of forum staff, and the rules, will result in suspension/removal of your account.

MJS
MT Asst. Admin.

I deeply apologize if you feel disrespected. I felt disrespected myself, but I am more than willing to let all of that go. I understand your concern, I am willing to take heed of your warning and apply myself accordingly.
I understand the rules and stand by my word to follow them with sincerety.
I understand everything that you have said.

As for my question, I feel that it may have been answered by some (if not all) of the suggestions from the other members.


Thank you, sir.


With Respect,
Aries Kai

 

[jks9199]

Folks,

MJS has made it clear. The forum rules (HERE) apply to everyone. I strongly urge everyone to remember that, and to remember also that the attitude hereabouts is "Friendly discussion"; it's even at the top of the page!

To be blunt, a "I don't care who I piss off" attitude is unpleasant to say the least, and trollish to say the most. Responding in kind to that sort of attitude isn't any better...

I hope that some posters are after a fresh start, and perhaps have stumbled a little on their way back in the door. If not, rest assured, they will "receive an invitation to the world" as Lady Sally Callahan phrased it so memorably.

In short:
PLEASE KEEP THE DISCUSSION POLITE AND RESPECTFUL.

jks9199
Sr. Moderator

 

[Chris Parker]

Okay, Aries, we're back again. Now, I'm going to disect this in a few different ways, hopefully you'll get more than just "what art" out of my words here. I recommend you read closely, and don't form any answer until you have read it a few times, you really need to understand what I'm saying and why I'm saying it.

Hello to you all and thank you for taking the time to read/answer my question!

I am interested in a specific "style", if you will, that includes a group of various different techniques that I would like to apply in self defense situations.

First off, remember that this type of question comes up incredibly often, so the answers will likely be pretty much the same as last time. In essence, the system is far less important than the instructor and school itself. But we'll also look at your phrasing throughout this post, as it needs attention if you actually want people to be willing to share with you.

You say that you are interested in a specific "style" (I assume you mean a particluar system, such as a particular form of karate, rather than just karate in the generic sense, right?) which includes a group of various techniques the you would like to apply in self defence situations... Well, the first question is how likely are you to get into a self-defence situation? The next, probably more important one, is why you think there should be an art which is designed just for you? Any system, once sufficient experience is gained, will give you the ability to generate your own prefered approach to it, tailoring as needed. But to ask for something to be already tailored as such is rather presumptious and arrogant. Often when you study a martial art, you will cover a lot af things that you may not see an immediate use for, however they may be essential to gaining skills in the art in ways you (as a beginner) cannot see or understand yet. So take the idea of looking for a perfectly suited system out of your mind. All that will do is ensure you never find it.

I will begin with what i've already looked into, and please, do not take offense to my expression of opinion. I have my tastes and likings that differ to others.


I have looked into Ninjutsu. I liked many of the things that I saw in Ninjutsu, primarily the Taijutsu techniques, the evasion techniques, and the knife offense/defense techniques.

What I did not like about Ninjutsu, is that practitioners have to practice with swords and other types of weapons that I probably wouldn't find immediately ready for me - given that I am confronted by a couple of thugs as i'm passing by, walking through the park or down the wrong street.
Also, I did not find a good school near me in the Dallas area that was with Genbukan.

See above. Sword training is incredibly good for getting concepts of angling, timing, distancing, and far more. Sword defence techniques morph very well into baseball bat and machette defences. But one of the reasons for training the various weapons (other than historical interest) is that they give you a very different feeling, and mindset, than just training unarmed. If you train seriously in the lethal use of a weapon, ideally, you will gain a greater understanding of mortality, and gain a greater respect for yourself and other people. So you missed the point of those, they are trained not for necessarily practical uses, but for cultivating the correct attitude, which is far more important than any technique.

As to there not being a Genbukan school, as I said, the individual school and instructor will be of far greater importance than the system, so don't limit yourself to just the Genbukan. Look at what is actually available to you, and go from there. I could recommend a particularly vicious art, but if it's only taught in a few locations, such as Canada, Japan, and England, that is of no use to you. Look around first.

These are the techniques that I find useful for myself in a fight:

1.) Strikes to the throat, eyegouges, eyerakes, biting, headbutting, strikes to the groin, strikes to vital parts of the head, strikes to vital parts of the entire body.

These can raise some very real legal issues.

2.) The use of hands, elbows, knees, AND feet.

3.) Great takedowns and at least SOME emphasis on grappling techniques. Also a good emphasis on ground-work (at least enough to be able to get back up on your feet. I would hate to bite the boot of another attacker while i'm wrestling/BJJ'ing around on the ground with his buddy.).

4.) Weapon defense techniques. Knife and gun disarms (whoever actually uses a gun up close probably shouldn't have a gun in their hands in the first place. they were designed for attacking an opponent/enemy at DISTANCES. Nevertheless, you still have the untrained "killers".), disarms with sticks and baseball bats.

5.) Evasion techniques. I think the best way to win a fight is to completely avoid one or get the hell out of it. It saves someone a big hospital bill and injuries, and/or having to pay money to post bond to get their butts out of jail.

6.) Good, strong stance(s).

To be honest, this list is a bit of a wish-list. There are a few arts that teach it, ninjutsu being one of them, but you need to accept that you will also learn things that you may not necessarily be as interested in. Swallow your ego and just do what the instructor is teaching. You may find that things such as the traditional weapons in a ninjutsu class will help curb that temper you have as you have a focus outside of the rather violent thoughts that you normally have (the above list is a tempered example of those thoughts, by the way).

Okay, the next part is going to involve some bolding by myself to highlight the way you are presenting yourself. You still need to work on a lot of this if you are going to stay here.


I think that's the jist of it.
Note, everybody: I am going to be straight forward with you.

Remember, you are still very young and to a lot of us here, very inexperienced. You have dabbled in a number of things, and there is a generic modern jujutsu-like system that you have done for a while but seem to have no confidence in. So to use phrasing like this, which is very demanding, is going to have people wondering who on earth you are and why they should care.

Once I get into the fight, I do not care about the person I am fighting. What I know, is that I have to take them down or out fast, effectively, and as accurately as all possible. I don't care how much pain I will cause them. I don't know about other states, but in the state of Texas, if you are assaulted and you end up hospitalizing the criminal - tough **** on him! You more than likely will NOT be arrested. I'd highly recommend witnesses, though! Somehow, I have been in situations where I have called the police after coming out on top in a fight, and I have not been arrested once.
Remember everybody, like I said before: If I can avoid the fight, I already feel that I won. Does that make me a coward? Absolutely not.

Again, it seems like you are trying to educate us on aspects of self defence. Remember, you are the one here asking the questions. Try to avoid lecturing, it doesn't come across well when you ask for advice, then proceed to tell us "how it is".

Anyways, sorry about all of the irrelevant information.

Which begs the question, if you not only thought it was irrelevant, but recognised that fact, why did you post it?

I am only looking for ideas on which martial art would probably best suit me. I am only looking for the professional opinion of others (not their personal opinion, no offense).

A number of people here have cross-trained, but no-one has experienced all that the martial arts have to offer. As for looking for ideas on which would suit you, well, none of us are you. So that is best answered by yourself. Again, look around where you are, and see what is available first. Bando is a great system, but if it isn't available to you, there's no point bringing it up to you.

But again, in your initial Meet and Greet late last year you said that you were only wanting to hear from people with more experience than you, you weren't interested in hearing from people with less than your 14 years (from memory). You were cautioned against such comments by myself and others, as you have no control over who answers, or what they say. And who knows, you may just learn something from one of the "peanut gallery" as you called them last time. Open your mind, or don't bother asking anything at all, there really is no point.

Here you ask for peoples' professional opinions, not their personal ones. Sorry, son, here you will get personal opinions. There are a number of instructors here, but the advice given is always a matter of personal opinion, not professional advice. We don't know you, we can't see what we would need to to be able to offer truly professional advice, realistically my professional advice might be to leave martial arts until you grow up a bit.

The way you have treated MJS is frankly arrogant, rude, and completely out of place. Do not let it happen again. You will find yourself on the outside looking in on yet another forum you have been banned from. Okay?

 

[MJS]

I deeply apologize if you feel disrespected. I felt disrespected myself, but I am more than willing to let all of that go. I understand your concern, I am willing to take heed of your warning and apply myself accordingly.
I understand the rules and stand by my word to follow them with sincerety.
I understand everything that you have said.

As for my question, I feel that it may have been answered by some (if not all) of the suggestions from the other members.


Thank you, sir.


With Respect,
Aries Kai

Let me address a few more things:

1) The respect issue is not just for staff, but for all members. IIRC, this was an issue for you in the past, and apparently still to this day.

2) Nothing more than Ninjutsu was offered or suggested? Oh really. Perhaps the following will help refresh your memory.

A) With this laundry list of things that you've done, or claim that you've done, you're still on a quest. Interesting.

B) In this thread, you ask about Muay Thai. Notice the reply from Omar, in which he states that there is no all around perfect style. You also stated that you agreed with him.

C) Here you ask about FMAs. many FMAists, myself included, gave you advice. Have you checked out any FMA schools?

D) Due to your actions, you managed to get this train wreck of a thread locked. Here you were asking about Machida. I believe in that thread, I stated that what you need to do, is sit down, find out what your goals are, and that I'd offer to help guide you to finding something to train in. Guess you didn't do your part. *shrug*

E) I started this thread, and you received some good advice. Did you take any of it?

F) Here is another you started on cross training. Did you take any advice?

So now we're full circle and here you are again, repeating history. See, I'm not the one digging up old bones sir, YOU are! My suggestions:

Instead of walking that fine line of trolling, take some of the advice that you've been given and put it to good use. You're getting huffy because you're not hearing what you want to hear. Continuing down the road that you're on here, will not get you far.

 

[AriesKai]

Hey everybody, I think that I have finally found my personal liking to Kajukenbo. I could explain why; but I feel that some things are better left "unsaid".

If anyone has anything that they would comment on or about Kajukenbo, please do so!


Thanks!

 

[blindsage]

Kajukenbo is a great, diverse style, my wife trains in it. It will not cover everything you are interested in, but it may be one of the closest. Enjoy.

 

[Blindside]

Hey everybody, I think that I have finally found my personal liking to Kajukenbo. I could explain why; but I feel that some things are better left "unsaid".

If anyone has anything that they would comment on or about Kajukenbo, please do so!

Great system, and it generally has an "old school" hard training ethic associated with it, which is a nice pattern to have in this day and age.

 

[Hawke]

Kajukenbo from my limited experience is a great style for self defense.

One of my favorite drills from this style is Bull in the Ring (other styles do this as well). You are in the center of the circle and your buddies are outside making a ring around you. The instructor calls out numbers/names for them to attack you. All you have to do is survive.