hello

[jay]

[FONT=&quot]i have been studying tae kwon do for roughly 10 years. i attained the rank of second dan in 1995 and took around 10 years off. recently i realized when i went to another school to continue my third (the dojong i was studying closed and the master opened started his own korean food restaurant.) i was told my degrees wernt valid there. i was 18 back then and didnt know such things about official kukiwon.
im solving that but i have a few questions.

one. i know tae kwon do is a very effective art. it has a very long history and my old master, YI was one of the best. he could take on anyone. he did. i heard of him walking into other dojongs and defeating other masters of other styles. this was in the 70s. why did instructors change the art so much since the 90s.
i see black belts in tae kwon do keep getting have been wiped out consistently in mix martial arts competitions K-1, pride fighting, or UFC. why is that because i know it is effective.

my second question, what happened to the united states tae kwon do union and what is this USA tae kwon do?

well one more question, where can i find the results from the first USTU junior Olympic competition. where did it take place it?[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

 

[Brad Dunne]

First off, Welcome to MartialTalk. I'll attempt to answer your questions as best I can and I'm sure other's will be along to assist.

why did instructors change the art so much since the 90s.

I'm not sure if you meant the 90's or the 70's, but in either case, the main reason for change(s) was due to the sport (Olympic) aspect taking control of most of TKD.

my second question, what happened to the united states tae kwon do union and what is this USA tae kwon do?

The USTU has become USA-TKD

well one more question, where can i find the results from the first USTU junior Olympic competition. where did it take place it?

You can most likely obtain that information by going to the USA-TKD web site.

A question for you, if I may.............. You said that your Dan rankings were not being honored by the new dojang, what was their reason for not honoring them?

 

[jay]

[FONT=&quot]because the dojong i received my dans from closed. they were from the master himself his own school certificates. not kukiwons.
he was perfectly qualified master. kukiwon eith dan. i think thewhole thing is silly but what can i do?
[/FONT]

 

[cali_tkdbruin]

Yup, that's why I always thought it was good to have a TKD certification of one of the larger, more well recognized TKD organizations. I picked up my dan certificates through the Kukkiwon which is affiliated with the World Taekwondo Federation.

BTW, Brad is very right, Taekwondo has become watered down because of its shift toward Sport/Olympic style TKD run by the WTF, and its shift away from the traditional style of TKD that it appears you studied. Anyway, welcome aboard and happy posting... :asian:

 

[Last Fearner]

Hello Jay, and welcome to Martial Talk.

[FONT=&quot]recently i realized when i went to another school to continue my third (the dojong i was studying closed and the master opened started his own korean food restaurant.) i was told my degrees wernt valid there.[/FONT]

Your degrees weren't valid where.... at the new dojang, or at the Korean restaurant?

[FONT=&quot]i was 18 back then and didnt know such things about official kukiwon.[/FONT]

Your age has nothing to do with it. I didn't know about Kwans when I was younger either. Kukkiwon has nothing to do with it. Apparently, you earned your Black Belt rank legitimately under a qualified and reputable Master who happens to have Kukkiwon certification. Therefore, your rank and credentials are just as valid and secure as the owner of this new Dojang. If they have a problem with it, and don't want to acknowledged your past rank then that is their problem. They need to grow up a bit, and stop being so insecure about their own rank (and you can tell them I said so!) :mst:

[FONT=&quot]i know tae kwon do is a very effective art..... why did instructors change the art so much since the 90s.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]i see black belts in tae kwon do keep getting have been wiped out consistently in mix martial arts competitions K-1, pride fighting, or UFC. why is that because i know it is effective.[/FONT]

The Art of Taekwondo has not changed in the past decade. It has grown in popularity which means more people are practicing and learning it (or attempting to learn it). With the popularity has come the spread of Taekwondo in the sport arena. Thus, there are those who enter Taekwondo mainly for the purpose of playing "games." Their main focus is tournaments and competing for Olympic Gold. If this quest satisfies them, then fine for them, but if it compromises the totality of what Taekwondo training should be, then they are short changing themselves. If they in-turn become "Black Belts," and open schools with no restrictions as to who can claim to be an instructor, and little guidelines on what qualifications are required to teach, then the public can be mislead into believing that this is the complete art of Taekwondo, which it is not.

Some will say that Taekwondo is being destroyed, diminished or "watered down" because of this. I disagree. This phenomenon is true only within those schools that lower their own standards, or among those who become "Black Belts" of these sport only oriented schools who don't know any better. This is not to say that a school which offers a complete Taekwondo program with realistic self defense can't also offer tournaments or even Olympic opportunity. It is a question of balance, priorities, and what is sacrificed for the element of sport.

Furthermore, if you are comparing what Taekwondo currently is to what is done in these "UFC" "Special-K" competitions - - don't. These are games with rules, and Taekwondo has its own rules. To mix does not make sense. In the street, the only rules are the ones you choose to follow, and when it comes to survival, the only laws that matter are the laws of nature. Those so-called Taekwondoists who choose to enter these specified games are not the cream of the crop, and do not represent what real Taekwondo is.

[FONT=&quot]my second question, what happened to the united states tae kwon do union and what is this USA tae kwon do?[/FONT]

The U.S.T.U. was formed out of the AAU. When Taekwondo got the official approval for the Olympics (Demonstration event in 1988) the WTF was charged with the international authority over rules and regulations. The WTF, in turn, recognized various "national governing bodies" (NGB). The USTU was the one in the United States that became the NGB. Due to growing corruption, disorganization, and disputes within, the USTU failed to maintain the approval of the WTF, and the United States Olympic Committee (USOC).

Therefore, a new organization, USA Taekwondo was formed to take the place of the USTU. The name is different, the leadership is different, but there are still complaints that the problems might not have been solved. In any even, I am not sure that I would say that the USTU became the USA Taekwondo, but that the USTU was replaced by the USA Taekwondo (might be splitting hairs, but I am sure there are those who would feel there is a significant difference).

Anyhow, as far as your current training, I suggest you respectfully tell the instructors at this new Dojang that you attained your Dan ranks legitimately (which they can verify with your instructor at the Korean restaurant), and they can either help you to get your rank confirmed with the Kukkiwon, or you will go train with someone who has a better grasp of reality, and more respect for the art rather than a piece of paper.

Good Luck
CM D.J. Eisenhart

 

[Yeti]

Hi Jay
Welcome to the board.

Sounds like they just want your $$.
I think Master Eisenhart said it best. See if the new school will help you (starting with recognizing your ranking) and go from there. If not, go find another dojang.

Good luck.

 

[The Kidd]

Welcome and have fun!

 

[IcemanSK]

Welcome to MT, Jay.

 

[terryl965]

Jay sirst off welcome and I too must agree with Master Eisenhart, they should honor your rank and help you gey it sorted out and be a man about it. Rank is up to the school owner but you have doc. that make your rank complete so it is find another school or have them help you if they are a 4th from the kukkiwon they can help if not they can't plain and simple.

 

[Miles]

Welcome to MT Jay!

Miles

 

[matt.m]

Hi Jay,

Welcome to MT. First of all it is nice to see a new member to the tkd bunch on this board. I would answer further, however the best already have.

Welcome again, I am sure you will find (With perserverance), the results and help you need.

Good luck my man,

Matt

 

[Kacey]

Welcome, and happy posting! :wavey: Good luck in finding what you need.

 

[Drac]

Greetings...

 

[JBrainard]

Ave and welcome to Martial Talk.

 

[Tames D]

Welcome.

 

[RED]

Welcome Jay.

My first thought on this is; go to the restaraunt and ask your old instructor if he can help you. Maybe he can reffer a traditional school for you to pick up your studies. Or maybe he'll know a Black Belt from the school that teaches somewhere local.

It was said once but it sounds like someone is trying to get some money out of you. Look around for a church or non profit organization they are a little more accepting. Where are you from, maybe someone can help you with that from here?

I can't help any with the organizations but TKD has changed since I started in the '80s. I remember doing an entire hour on a walking stance low deffence!! This included everyone, white belts to 3-4th degree Black Belts!! I haven't seen that for years.

 

[TKDDAD]

First, Welcome to Martial Talk.

I don't know if this is possible, but from what I read. You implied that your old Master was Kukkiwon certified.

Would it be possible for him to get your 2nd Poom/Dan certified through Kukkiwon?

Most likely you would have to pay some fee to get your Dan certified by Kukkiwon. Once you are certifed by Kukkiwon, then there would be no question about your Dan level with other schools.

Anyways, this was only a thought I had for a possible solution to your situation.
​

 

[TKDmel]

Welcome to MT!

 

[wayofhandandfoot]

Tae kwon do was not initially made for ring. It's made for the street. If you put limitations such as rules it loses its substance. if you want to train for the ring you take up k-1, olympic tkd, boxing, judo, MMA or whatever so you can train according to the rules. But for street defense you take tkd, karate, aikido, street ju jitsu, hapkido, etc. and studying the weakness of the opponents body. and focusing on your next move for defense.

 

[Laurentkd]

Welcome!

I too would go to your old instructor and see if he can point you in a good direction. I bet he will be excited you still want to train and will try to help you how he can.