Has anyone studied under Grandmaster JiMong Choe?

[VictorV]

I was looking for a school close to where I go to college. I came across this one because it's about 5 minutes away. Anyone have any information on him?

 

[VictorV]

Here's the website: http://www.choesmoorymwon.com/home.html

Any thoughts?

 

[milewski]

Well my first thought is why he is wearing Shaolin Monks clothing and the other problem is his lineage. Hapkido is not an ancient buddist art.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

Well...

You need to understand that since he is a reincarnated grandmaster, and has been on a cosmic journey, he can claim this sort of thing. At least according to his bio page.

 

[VictorV]

That's the thing that made me really uneasy. Talked to a couple people and they seem to enjoy it. Will be trying the free lessons this week. Other place I'm looking at teaches Tang Soo Do and BJJ.

 

[Kong Soo Do]

That's the thing that made me really uneasy. Talked to a couple people and they seem to enjoy it. Will be trying the free lessons this week. Other place I'm looking at teaches Tang Soo Do and BJJ.

I know quite a few people that train/teach TSD and they think/speak very highly of it. I also have a nephew that trains/teaches BJJ and it is a passion for him. Depending on what you're looking for, either would/could serve you well.

 

[dortiz]

Can of worms but consider this. There are LOTS of great Korean Martial Artist that came from a generation born of very tough times. Many of them were surrounded by other great fellows who also fabricated levels of importance and history to build status or in my opinion "FACE".
Thus 5000 year old histories etc.
However!!!!!
Most of this generation also happen to be some really freaking awesome martial artists. So if you can discount that part and if they are great teachers its not always so bad to learn there. Just dont drink too much of the Koolaid. I like to just smile, nod and say thank you : )

 

[Kong Soo Do]

It very well be excellent training. And only first-hand investigation will show whether it is or isn't. It may depend on how much 'cosmic' stuff they put into the training and the level that the student wishes to work with. Case-by-case basis.

 

[VictorV]

Nothing cosmic. Pretty decent. Learned some moves. Wanted to stay around and see the ground game, but it became super-secret agent squirrel stuff only available to members. Getting my shoes on and they started rollin'. Looked a lot like BJJ. The other place was open about the GJJ being a compliment to the TSD. I'm going to go do the free lessons there and see how it fits.

 

[Flying Crane]

yah know, I don't know anything about this guy, but his presentation on his website just gave me the creeps. Made me feel like I need a shower.

Lot's of red flags waving around, mostly around the cultish feel of the place. All this talk of abbots and childhood prophecies about his coming greatness, grandfather's mountain temple, practically enlightened by the age of ten, the background music, etc. That's the stuff that makes we walk the other way. The training could be good, I dunno. But I have a real hard time getting past the kool-aid creep factor with this kind of thing. When people present themselves in this kind of hokey way it just makes me wonder what they are hiding.

 

[milewski]

Damn I missed that part, well since he is the reincarnated GM I'll just drink the kool-aid and sign up.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Nothing cosmic. Pretty decent. Learned some moves. Wanted to stay around and see the ground game, but it became super-secret agent squirrel stuff only available to members. Getting my shoes on and they started rollin'. Looked a lot like BJJ. The other place was open about the GJJ being a compliment to the TSD. I'm going to go do the free lessons there and see how it fits.

So essentially, you have to be Morocco Mole to learn from Secret Squirrel. Does he give you a fez on sign up?

 

[puunui]

Most of this generation also happen to be some really freaking awesome martial artists. So if you can discount that part and if they are great teachers its not always so bad to learn there. Just dont drink too much of the Koolaid. I like to just smile, nod and say thank you : )

Great answer.

 

[KangJo]

Hey all,

I'm new to this blog, and wanted to search for HapKiDo because that is the martial art that I have studied for a long time. Seeing this kind of thing made me a little sick, I mean as a Lifetime Martial Artist I would never talk down on someone who has spent their whole life studying and teaching Martial Arts at least until I have meet them personally and was able to make an educated decision on the quality of their character and what they teach.

I have never personally trained under Grandmaster Choe but I studied under a different Korean Grandmaster who explained the history of Korean Martial Arts to me from a Korean perspective. I understand from reading that site how people who don't know the history can interpret things like that. Traditional Korean Arts, (just like most other Asian arts) traces its roots back thousands of years to when Zen was first introduced to China then Korea by Bodhidharma. He is considered the founder of KungFu and Zen, and my Grandmaster explained that it is from here that HapKiDo stems from. Because of this history many traditional Martial Arts families have histories similar to the one I read on that site.

I guess what I am trying to say is that from my personal experience with a Korean Grandmaster who had a similar history, this is nothing to base a decision on. I wouldn't trade the time I spent training with him for the world. He was an excellent teacher and friend.

 

[iron_ox]

Hey all,

I'm new to this blog, and wanted to search for HapKiDo because that is the martial art that I have studied for a long time. Seeing this kind of thing made me a little sick, I mean as a Lifetime Martial Artist I would never talk down on someone who has spent their whole life studying and teaching Martial Arts at least until I have meet them personally and was able to make an educated decision on the quality of their character and what they teach.

I have never personally trained under Grandmaster Choe but I studied under a different Korean Grandmaster who explained the history of Korean Martial Arts to me from a Korean perspective. I understand from reading that site how people who don't know the history can interpret things like that. Traditional Korean Arts, (just like most other Asian arts) traces its roots back thousands of years to when Zen was first introduced to China then Korea by Bodhidharma. He is considered the founder of KungFu and Zen, and my Grandmaster explained that it is from here that HapKiDo stems from. Because of this history many traditional Martial Arts families have histories similar to the one I read on that site.

I guess what I am trying to say is that from my personal experience with a Korean Grandmaster who had a similar history, this is nothing to base a decision on. I wouldn't trade the time I spent training with him for the world. He was an excellent teacher and friend.

Hello,

What exactly "makes you sick"? The history of Hapkido on the listed website is laughable. Hapkido was founded in Korea in 1948 - not 372, not through Kung fu, or anything else. So why exactly is this not a reason to make a decision?

 

[Doomx2001]

Hello,

What exactly "makes you sick"? The history of Hapkido on the listed website is laughable. Hapkido was founded in Korea in 1948 - not 372, not through Kung fu, or anything else. So why exactly is this not a reason to make a decision?

I agree with Iron_Ox that Hapkido started around 1948. Hapkido was derived from Daito-Aikijujutsu (with Judo, Taekyon, and several other arts thrown in by different masters) and later evolved into the art that we know it as today. Koreans tend to be very nationalistic to the point that they often reinvent history in the name of national pride, especially when it involves anything Japanese (Daito Ryu/Hapkido connection). That doesn't mean that Hapkido isn't Korean, because it is a very Korean martial art. But the origins, its not an ancient Korean martial art. Its a Modern one. KangJo, I recommend that you do some research on Hapkido from as many sources as you can, and you might come to the same conclusion. This statement isn't anything against your teacher as he was probably told exactly the same thing as he told you when he first started training.

 

[iron_ox]

I agree with Iron_Ox that Hapkido started around 1948. Hapkido was derived from Daito-Aikijujutsu (with Judo, Taekyon, and several other arts thrown in by different masters) and later evolved into the art that we know it as today.

Hello Doomx2001,

Choi Dojunim said he studied with Sokaku Soke only, not any other arts, and frankly all the "evolving" you speak of has mainly occurred as people needed to add curriculum to Hapkido that they only knew a small amount of...

 

[Doomx2001]

Hello Doomx2001,

Choi Dojunim said he studied with Sokaku Soke only, not any other arts, and frankly all the "evolving" you speak of has mainly occurred as people needed to add curriculum to Hapkido that they only knew a small amount of...

That is exactly what I said. If you read what I wrote, I said, "with Judo, taekyon, and several other arts thrown in by different masters". I never once said that GM Choi incorporated any other martial arts into what he did.

 

[oftheherd1]

...

I guess what I am trying to say is that from my personal experience with a Korean Grandmaster who had a similar history, this is nothing to base a decision on. I wouldn't trade the time I spent training with him for the world. He was an excellent teacher and friend.

From my experience with a Korean Grandmaster, who was also a friend, who knew all the early big names in Hapkido, the art was started by a Korean, Choi Yong Sul (not the Choe family), who came from Japan. If your teacher told me otherwise, and I respected his teaching, I would not openly contradict him nor belittle him. But I would ask, which you apparently did, and would put a lot of salt on his answer.

Due muchly to Confucianism, great emphasis is placed on things of antiquity. The older something is, the more it is to be venerated. Sometimes in the orient, you will find things artificially antiquated for that reason. It may not be presented as a lie; something may have been read which lead to a thought process that allowed for conjecture on an art's antiquity. Then it is accepted to validate the antiquity of the art, merely to enhance the value of the art. You see, there have been martial arts in Korea for a very long time. Probably at least 2000 years.

What all those arts knew or taught isn't always easy to establish as fact. Very possibly the Koreans learned those arts as they were taught in China. They may have made adaptations that suited their culture and their geographical location. As time progressed, it seems likely that some martial art or arts, eventually 'knew' all there was to know about unarmed (or even armed) combat. How many ways can you block, punch, kick, grapple, fall, or manipulate pressure points? Some masters of combat arts would likely have specialized due to their own abilities or preferences. It is quite plausible that is how different arts developed.

But I am unaware of any art that can trace itself back to any one person, or other art, and say 'this was the beginning of MA, and we were there, and we have an unbroken line from there to now' Nor can Korean MA say such a thing about their different main arts, to my knowledge. There is no unbroken line from any of the old Korean MA to Hapkido

However, regardless of how many arts in whatever country, decided to use things that ended up in Hapkido, it was started by Choi Yong Sul (or Sool), after he returned from a long lifetime in Japan. It does have a Korean flavor. That is neither good nor bad. It is just Hapkido.

 

[iron_ox]

That is exactly what I said. If you read what I wrote, I said, "with Judo, taekyon, and several other arts thrown in by different masters". I never once said that GM Choi incorporated any other martial arts into what he did.

The point I was trying to make, poorly apparently, is that the art was complete long before any of Choi Dojunim's students or others "added" anything from anywhere. Hapkido is the art of Choi Dojunim, most of the "additions" are not really part of the art at all.