Last year we started implementing colored sashes, and it was fine. Lately though, a couple of students have in two months been promoted over students who have been attending regularly for nearly a year. A few of the other lower level students are becoming discouraged, and to be perfectly honest I am as well. They say they'll be testing to chum kiu in 3 months, but the fastest anyone else has gotten to that level was 2 years. What's more is that one of these people has developed an ego, and has been impatient and short with other students (although nobody ranking above him). I have never questioned my instructor, but I am starting to lose faith in the integrity of my school. And to be honest, I can't tell if I am just needlessly bitter. How do I address this? Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Declining standards? Or resisting change?
- Thread starter Anuka
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Danny T
Senior Master
Do the colored sashes make anyone's skills and abilities better?
Does anyone receiving a sash considered higher level than yours diminish your skills and abilities?
Does you getting a different colored sash increase your skills and abilities?
Keep training and compare yourself to yourself not others. It isn't about the color of the sash.
Have you spoken to your instructor about what you need to do to grow and advance in your skills and abilities?
Does anyone receiving a sash considered higher level than yours diminish your skills and abilities?
Does you getting a different colored sash increase your skills and abilities?
Keep training and compare yourself to yourself not others. It isn't about the color of the sash.
Have you spoken to your instructor about what you need to do to grow and advance in your skills and abilities?
I agree with above, since the sashes are an implementation of your club they hold little value. In some cases I have also noticed that those who boast the most and wants to achieve a higher rank above the rest often find themselves alone and bored in the end. Most often, but not always, those people quit to move on to other pastures way before their skills were truly set.
Strive to be better than you were yesterday every day, all else is just gonna keep you behind the others.
And finally, that guy with an ego. Some has it, a few drops it eventually and some don´t. Just dont let it get to you, often also an ego gets in the way of learning from your misstakes. If he keeps training against people he feels beneath himself how may he learn anything at all?
Strive to be better than you were yesterday every day, all else is just gonna keep you behind the others.
And finally, that guy with an ego. Some has it, a few drops it eventually and some don´t. Just dont let it get to you, often also an ego gets in the way of learning from your misstakes. If he keeps training against people he feels beneath himself how may he learn anything at all?
- Thread Starter
- #4
You make some solid points. It's easy to forget that the sashes only hold the value we give them. I have not asked my instructor about what I need to grow, I just train like normal. I suppose I was just bitter that some are held to different standards, even if it's not directly impacting me .
- Thread Starter
- #5
Thank you. I will try to keep that in mind (the last part especially). I also realized I have a bias against him because one of the people he is rude to is my wife. Looking back to when I was fresh into kung fu, I thought I was Billy bad *** too. By comparing myself to him I must be showing my own ego. I could stand to be more humble as well.
How does this affect your training? Does it change what you need to work on or what material your instructor is teaching you?
Some people are (for one reason or another) able to progress through material significantly quicker than others, especially at the lower levels. Long term, what counts is consistent practice. I've met a lot of people over the years who are more talented than I am and progress more quickly while they are training. Most of them dropped out after a year or two or three. I'm still training and improving.
If the guy is a jerk, he would have ended up showing his jerkitude eventually regardless. Getting promoted might have just revealed it a bit earlier.
Is the integrity of the school based on everybody being promoted in the same amount of time or on the instructor giving you good instruction?
- Thread Starter
- #7
I suppose it doesn't really affect my training, I may just be bitter. As far as the integrity goes, I do still believe in my instructor and my training, it just feels like the standards are declining and my school is becoming a belt farm. I feel this way because these guys don't have as good of structure, relaxation and form as some of the others, but they spend a lot of money at the school.
- Thread Starter
- #8
Thanks everyone for your response and questions. After seeing it all layed out in writing, I am starting to feel a bit childish. You guys have reminded me that I am not free of ego, and I should focus inwardly.
If you don't think the guys being promoted quickly are as skilled as the folks they are being promoted over then there are a couple of possibilities:
1) Your evaluation is incorrect. You are judging their technique from a beginner's perspective and you instructor has a more advanced viewpoint which allows him to see that these people are getting something that you aren't.
2) Your evaluation is correct. Their technique isn't that good and they are being promoted based on other factors (friendship with the instructor, money, whatever). In that case, you know that the rank your instructor hands out isn't that meaningful because he isn't applying consistent standards. In that case, there's no point in you worrying about achieving rank under your instructor since you don't know what it would mean. Best to just focus on learning the material as best you can for its own sake. Hey ... isn't that what you should be doing anyway?
Danny T
Senior Master
The thing about sashes and belts is that for some reason people tend to focus on them as a level of prestige when it is only about one's knowledge, skill and ability in reference to the schools curriculum and/or standards. Or should be anyway. Does that really mean anything? Doesn't matter what kind of uniform one wears or color of the sash/belt what matters is increasing and honing your knowledge, your skills, your abilities. Not compared to someone else but compared to yourself. Finally if you are completely honest with yourself if everyone were to take off their uniforms/sashes and then just train and practice everyone will know in a very short time who has the greater knowledge, the greater skills, and who is working the hardest to better theirs. Train with an openness to learn, be the most awesome training partner on the floor, and humbly practice to the best of your ability.
GiYu - Todd
Green Belt
If he's being rude or egotistical to people (and your wife), you should address this with him and tell him you don't appreciate his behavior. Perhaps he's not mature enough to realize how he's behaving. This is the type of thing that will quietly drive lots of good students away and hurt the training environment of the school.
If his ego is too big for this, then talk with your instructor. I doubt he wants to lose students, and should hopefully take steps to maintain some traquility.
Alternatively, if you are more skilled than him, you can give him a little pursuation on the mats. Often, putting a bully in his place will cause his attitude to change, or make him leave. I've only encountered one person I needed to do this with... and now he is much nicer to everyone, especially me.
Sounds like you need a change. Will you be trying to find another WC instructor, or do you want to try a different art?
- Thread Starter
- #14
That is a tough question. I really enjoy WC and I have spent a few years practicing. If I start at a new school, I may have to start all over, so I'm not closed to trying something new.
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It's not the school or your instructor, it's the belt system. The problems that you are seeing are common with a belted system. You aren't bitter, you are just focusing on the wrong thing. Forget the belt, forget the promotion and concentrate on yourself and your development. In kung fu colored belts and sashes don't mean anything. Your school probably started using colored sashes because it attracts people who only care about the color belt system.
Most kung fu school do this because of financial reasons.
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Exactly correct. I used to think highly of black belts as level of skill in the past but now they have no meaning to me. I don't know how to take it when people say that they are a black belt, because a black belt has no meaning for me in terms of black belt = skill level. When people tell me this, I don't know if I should be happy for them or that it's a big achievement for them. I'm so glad that my school didn't bend to the belted system.
IMO belt/sash systems are archaic and should be abandoned rather than tacked on if TMAs want to have any hope of evolving.
Oh boy.
If a WC school decides to make you start all over, they're not worth bothering with unless you have a really, really low skill level or the system you practice is completely different.
Oh boy.
If a WC school decides to make you start all over, they're not worth bothering with unless you have a really, really low skill level or the system you practice is completely different.
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I agree. I see this happen in some belted systems where the person is skilled in karate but because it's a different school and teacher the student has to start from the bottom. Like you, it makes sense when the system is completely different or when the existing skill level is low. I could go to any Jow Ga kung fu school and not start from the beginning. I may have to learn to do certain moves differently but other than that it should almost be a continuation. Even if the forms are different my skill set should be good enough to quickly learn a form that is different from the one I learned.
- Thread Starter
- #19
The schools around here seem to put a lot of importance on lineage. A couple years ago my instructor moved away and the schools I called at that time were pretty sure I'd have to relearn my form.
Eric_H
Black Belt
@Marnetmar - contracts are a reality of MA business, as long as there is a reasonable/sane way out of it, there's nothing wrong with them.
To the OP - have you considered your teacher's point of view? How well is the school doing overall? How many new students come in every month? It may be he needed to change because the way he was training people made it financially unsustainable. It's easy to criticize from your standpoint, and I did the same before I understood the reality of running a MA school. But Sifu has to eat too, y'know?
That said, if it bothers you, you are a customer and have the right to vote with your dollars. The world is full of great schools and teachers. Go find one if your current cup of tea tastes bad - maybe someone here can even give a recommendation or introduction?
To the OP - have you considered your teacher's point of view? How well is the school doing overall? How many new students come in every month? It may be he needed to change because the way he was training people made it financially unsustainable. It's easy to criticize from your standpoint, and I did the same before I understood the reality of running a MA school. But Sifu has to eat too, y'know?
That said, if it bothers you, you are a customer and have the right to vote with your dollars. The world is full of great schools and teachers. Go find one if your current cup of tea tastes bad - maybe someone here can even give a recommendation or introduction?
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