Crashing Elbow and sister techs...

[Flying Crane]

These are three that I consider "sister" techniques:

Crashing Elbow
Divided Swords
Flashing Wings

What do you all think of them?

I like them, but prefer Crashing Elbow. Seems to me the others could just be variations on the same tech.

 

[Touch Of Death]

I only know Flashing Wings in EPAK; could you write them out for us?
Sean

 

[Jim Hanna]

Good techniques. I read somewhere that someone said that if you do seven swords right you will really only do 2 swords. I like that. It resonates with me. (If anyone knows where that quote came from I would like to acknowledge the speaker).

This series of techniques is the same. If you do the inward block and forearm smash to the liver right, you won't be doing anything else.

Part of the problem that I see, is that people hurry through the good stuff to get to the finishing material as quickly as they can, thereby weakening the good stuff. In effect, they screw the timing up.

Jim

 

[Flying Crane]

Good techniques. I read somewhere that someone said that if you do seven swords right you will really only do 2 swords. I like that. It resonates with me. (If anyone knows where that quote came from I would like to acknowledge the speaker).

This series of techniques is the same. If you do the inward block and forearm smash to the liver right, you won't be doing anything else.

Part of the problem that I see, is that people hurry through the good stuff to get to the finishing material as quickly as they can, thereby weakening the good stuff. In effect, they screw the timing up.

Jim

A lot here I can agree with. Thanks for the thoughts!

I kind of find that I dont trust the elbow strikes. I don't trust that I would be close enough to land them well and I'm inclined to make the first elbow a punch instead. My followup would be dictate by the response my punch gets.

 

[Flying Crane]

I only know Flashing Wings in EPAK; could you write them out for us?
Sean

Crashing Elbow
Defense against a right punch from 12:00
Step to 11:00 with the left foot to evade the punch and block with a left inward block. Pivot into a bow stance facing 12:00 and drive a right forward elbow smash thru the front of his ribs or solar plexus (or liver, as Jim Hanna has suggested). As he doubles over, drive a right elbow jab into his kidney.

Divided Swords.
Same technique as Crashing Elbow, but finishes differently.
After the forward elbow smash to the liver, finish with a simultaneous right knifehand to the back of his neck and left knifehand to his kidney.

Flashing Wings
Same technique as Crashing Elbow, but finishes differently.
After the elbow jab to the kidney, pivot to a soft bow stance facing 5:00ish and deliver a right, then left, kifehand thru the back of his neck as you drop into the stance. Pivot back up into a horse stance and finish with a right knifehand to the bridge of the nose.

There are some variations in these, but I think the basic form of the tech is really the most important and worth discussing.

 

[PatMunk]

A lot here I can agree with. Thanks for the thoughts!

I kind of find that I dont trust the elbow strikes. I don't trust that I would be close enough to land them well and I'm inclined to make the first elbow a punch instead. My followup would be dictate by the response my punch gets.

This is why we use a shuffle step when delivering the forearm strike .. puts you close enough to use the forearm strike ...

 

[PatMunk]

Good techniques. I read somewhere that someone said that if you do seven swords right you will really only do 2 swords. I like that. It resonates with me. (If anyone knows where that quote came from I would like to acknowledge the speaker).

Jim

Jim, I've made that statement many times over the years .... but I'm not sure that I'm the one that you are thinking about ... but you never know .....

 

[PatMunk]

Personally I like forearm strikes ... I've done many over the years ... Every time I've done one of these techniques the attacker was on the ground after the forearm strike and any further strikes were not needed ...

When doing a training class at the Police Academy I taught at I did crashing elbows on a student during a demonstration. He had made a comment that he'd take the first hit to the body because of his body armor and then he'd take out the attacker.. So I had him get his body armor on and then put one of the Karate Sparring chest protector on over it...

When he threw his punch I did Crashing Elbows. As soon as I made contact with the forearm he hit the floor. He not only got a new prospective of what a forearm could do .. but also learned what his body armor couldn't do for him.

You'll find that if you step to 10:30 or 11:00 for the block .. you'll more than likely have to use a shuffle step to use the forearm strike. But it's very effective.

 

[KenpoDave]

Divided Swords.
Same technique as Crashing Elbow, but finishes differently.
After the forward elbow smash to the liver, finish with a simultaneous right knifehand to the back of his neck and left knifehand to his kidney.

At the Gathering of Eagles (1999) Ted Sumner was giving a seminar on nerve striking. He got to this one and asked how many of us thought the knifehands were delivered to the back of the neck and the kidney. We all did. He proceeded to explain and demonstrate that the strikes should be delivered to the diaphragm on the back, and the hollow point at the base of the skull (occipital nerve) SIMULTANEOUSLY. Then we practiced. My partner was a 7th black, I was a 3rd. He kept asking me to hit him a little harder. For my part, I could tell that the synch was a little off on the strikes, when suddenly, with a light to medium shot, they landed accurately and simultaneously and he went out and dropped like a sack of potatoes.

I like this technique alot now!

Flashing Wings
Same technique as Crashing Elbow, but finishes differently.
After the elbow jab to the kidney, pivot to a soft bow stance facing 5:00ish and deliver a right, then left, kifehand thru the back of his neck as you drop into the stance. Pivot back up into a horse stance and finish with a right knifehand to the bridge of the nose.

I was taught 2 knifehands to the back of the neck, as in Arcing Blades. I really like Dave German's version of this technique and teach it as a (B). The 2 kniehands to the back of the neck sweep down the arm instead. The knifehand to the nose becomes a ridgehand to the throat, and you finish from there with Sleeper.

I love all three of these. I view Crashing Elbows as the base technique, and the one with the most raw power.

But my opponent will benefit more from the other two because after his punch, he gets to take a nap!

 

[MJS]

These are three that I consider "sister" techniques:

Crashing Elbow
Divided Swords
Flashing Wings

What do you all think of them?

I like them, but prefer Crashing Elbow. Seems to me the others could just be variations on the same tech.

All solid techniques IMO. The only difference is in Crashing Elbows. Instead of ending with another elbow strike, we do a backfist strike to the kidneys.

Mike

 

[Flying Crane]

All solid techniques IMO. The only difference is in Crashing Elbows. Instead of ending with another elbow strike, we do a backfist strike to the kidneys.

Mike

Yes, I think we held that one as Variation B.

 

[Flying Crane]

Thanks for the replies, everyone, you've given me some things to chew on.

 

[KenpoDave]

Thanks for the replies, everyone, you've given me some things to chew on.

The trick is in not finding yourself chewing on the elbow!!!

 

[Flying Crane]

The trick is in not finding yourself chewing on the elbow!!!

Aye!!

 

[Touch Of Death]

A lot here I can agree with. Thanks for the thoughts!

I kind of find that I dont trust the elbow strikes. I don't trust that I would be close enough to land them well and I'm inclined to make the first elbow a punch instead. My followup would be dictate by the response my punch gets.

You are starting to far away. Always think thundering hammer variations when doing these techs. First move... punch through his strike to drive his head back. Second move... shuffle up to an upper cut and drive a straight elbow (not flapping) to the floating ribs, crash through. Third move... reverse direction and elbow him in the kidney.
Sean

 

[KenpoDave]

You are starting to far away. Always think thundering hammer variations when doing these techs. First move... punch through his strike to drive his head back. Second move... shuffle up to an upper cut and drive a straight elbow (not flapping) to the floating ribs, crash through. Third move... reverse direction and elbow him in the kidney.
Sean

Good point, remember that it is Crashing Elbows, not Raking Elbows. In order to crash, things must break...

 

[Touch Of Death]

You are starting to far away. Always think thundering hammer variations when doing these techs. First move... punch through his strike to drive his head back. Second move... shuffle up to an upper cut and drive a straight elbow (not flapping) to the floating ribs, crash through. Third move... reverse direction and elbow him in the kidney.
Sean

Just for clarification the elbow culminates with a forward bow.
sean

 

[KenpoDave]

Just for clarification the elbow culminates with a forward bow.
sean

But it continues beyond. We call it a full bow, because the movement is circular, and although contact is made at the ribs, the strike ends out behind the back, which gives it the follow up strike and the plural name.

 

[Touch Of Death]

But it continues beyond. We call it a full bow, because the movement is circular, and although contact is made at the ribs, the strike ends out behind the back, which gives it the follow up strike and the plural name.

Figure eights and no lock out.
Sean

 

[KenpoDave]

Figure eights and no lock out.
Sean

Yep.