Cool New Cars!

[Rich Parsons]

Go here: http://autos.msn.com/home/streamingvideo.aspx?src=msn

And check out a new Fuel Cell Car (* Hydrogen *)

 

[Cliarlaoch]

Sweet!

I like the Hot Wheels one!

 

[Rich Parsons]

Another Article on Hydrogen development can be found Here.

 

[SHinT]

I Thought this was a martials arts forum


SHinT

 

[Rich Parsons]

I Thought this was a martials arts forum


SHinT

Yes, it is a martial arts forum.

This is the Locker room where other topis can be discussed.

The study is another area where non-martial arts can be discussed and or debated.

The Bar and grill is where you can sit back and be silly.

The Comedy Cafe is where jokes go.

The Rec Room is for sports and entertainment MA and Non-MA.

Computer Talk is for technical discussions about computer and computer support.

Yet, the main premise for this site is to discuss Martial Arts.

:asian:

 

[Spud]

I’m a little concerned about hydrogen fuel cells in autos as the overall amount of energy required from going from the raw materials to actually getting the tires moving on the road is about comparable with standard gas engines. Keep in mind, producing hydrogen requires a lot of electrical power (coal plants). Lastly – the market for palladium and platinum required for fuel cells being cornered by Nuevo Russian tycoons.

That being said, the technology is promising and new applications should be pursued (in the context of the big picture).

 

[Rich Parsons]

I’m a little concerned about hydrogen fuel cells in autos as the overall amount of energy required from going from the raw materials to actually getting the tires moving on the road is about comparable with standard gas engines. Keep in mind, producing hydrogen requires a lot of electrical power (coal plants). Lastly – the market for palladium and platinum required for fuel cells being cornered by Nuevo Russian tycoons.

That being said, the technology is promising and new applications should be pursued (in the context of the big picture).

Spud,

With 40 to 60% efficiency on the transfer of energy for Fuel cell and the energy to create and store hydrogen is electricity intensive. Like you said the coal plants burn sulfur coal which causes acid rain. Although it does remove the emissions from the tail pipe and places like LA could have cleaner air, only the air miles away is now worse.

Yet like you said we will not get there until we do the research and development to make the steps and improvements.

 

[Spud]

Indeed Rich - there is some cool stuff on the horizon and the need for reducing emissions is huge. I look forward to the development and implementation of cleaner technologies (along with the return of light rail, trolleys and bicycles).

 

[Ender]

I’m a little concerned about hydrogen fuel cells in autos as the overall amount of energy required from going from the raw materials to actually getting the tires moving on the road is about comparable with standard gas engines. Keep in mind, producing hydrogen requires a lot of electrical power (coal plants). Lastly – the market for palladium and platinum required for fuel cells being cornered by Nuevo Russian tycoons.

That being said, the technology is promising and new applications should be pursued (in the context of the big picture).

You have a very valid point about the efficiency to produce the energy required from the raw materials. However, progress comes incrementally and not usually in leaps. I'm sure this obstacle will be overcome to the point where it will become a cheap source of energy. When I was working at JPL we were investigating "mini-nukes" to power spacecraft because solar power diminishes the further you get from the sun, and liquid propellants eventually run out. Now granted, this can be dangerous, but some of this technology may be adapted into civilian use. Also, using coal is ONE of the means required to produce the electricity and not neccessarily the only source.

another intertesting point you bring up is cornering of the market by Russian tycoons. I would like to read more about if you have the sources.

 

[Rich Parsons]

You have a very valid point about the efficiency to produce the energy required from the raw materials. However, progress comes incrementally and not usually in leaps. I'm sure this obstacle will be overcome to the point where it will become a cheap source of energy. When I was working at JPL we were investigating "mini-nukes" to power spacecraft because solar power diminishes the further you get from the sun, and liquid propellants eventually run out. Now granted, this can be dangerous, but some of this technology may be adapted into civilian use. Also, using coal is ONE of the means required to produce the electricity and not neccessarily the only source.

another intertesting point you bring up is cornering of the market by Russian tycoons. I would like to read more about if you have the sources.

Hey Ender,

I agree with the incremental steps. Mini-nuke Power plants are a cool idea, for space travel and research. Once again the main technologies we have are either first or second generation from space research or military research.

And yes there are other forms of generating electricty such as water and damns, and oil, and wind, yet, 60% of all the coal used is a low grade coal that contains sulfur. I have no problems with making better requirements for vehicles. I just would like people to be educated on the whole process .

Thanks
:asian:

 

[Ender]

Another point I wanted to make was the rising gas prices. I was listening to an economist and the discussion for alternative fuels. He was stating that gas prices would need to rise to $4/gallon before we see any type of migration to Hybrid/electrical cars. The technology is there with Honda, GM, Ford and Toyota, but production costs are still a bit prohibitive.

Also he was stating that although there are some politics in gas prices (OPEC/US/EU etc) the emergence of China as a major economic player will have more of an impact on energy needs in the future. The demand for oil for China is increasing dramatically right now. They are already having an impact on the US as we export more of our resources to feed this growing economy, and in about 10-15 years, the Chinese economy may catch up to ours. China MAY become the dominant superpower, while we could be relegated to third place behind the EU.

 

[Spud]

another intertesting point you bring up is cornering of the market by Russian tycoons. I would like to read more about if you have the sources.

http://www.bday.co.za/bday/content/direct/1,3523,1610371-6078-0,00.html
http://www.motherjones.com/news/outfront/2004/05/04_406.html
http://www.bday.co.za/bday/content/direct/1,3523,1604723-6078-0,00.html
The mojo piece has some interesting points if you can get past the slant against the Whitehouse.

Ooooh just found this, probably the most detailed.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/FE05Ag01.html

 

[Ender]

http://www.bday.co.za/bday/content/direct/1,3523,1610371-6078-0,00.html
http://www.motherjones.com/news/outfront/2004/05/04_406.html
http://www.bday.co.za/bday/content/direct/1,3523,1604723-6078-0,00.html
The mojo piece has some interesting points if you can get past the slant against the Whitehouse.

Ooooh just found this, probably the most detailed.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/FE05Ag01.html

Thanks!..very interesting reading.

 

[Andi]

http://www.aquada.co.uk

Due to popular demand, they recently decided to up-production and slash prices to just £75,000 each. ($135,000.)

Impressive though, with a brilliant engine.

 

[7starmantis]

Um hydrogen powered eh? Hindenburg ring a bell to anyone?

J/K I think this is a promising field for research, we still need further development, but it is very promising.


7sm