Bridge Collapse = Terrorism?

[Jade Tigress]

Ok, so I'm sure everyone has already heard about the bridge collapse in Minnesota.

If not, here's the article.

Tragic and another *freak* incident. What struck me was the following comment:

"This particular section or freeway was under repair," Minneapolis fire Chief Jim Clack said. "We don't know yet what caused the collapse. We do not believe at this point there was any terrorism or nefarious activity -- it was just a structural collapse."

I know it's something that must always be considered, but I am naive? I didn't even think of terrorism in this instance until I read that. Did any of you? Am I foolish to not constantly be on the alert or is our country, for lack of a better word, paranoid?

 

[Blotan Hunka]

When your country is currently involved in a war, and after 9/11, I believe that awareness is necssary. Bridges, tunnels etc. are key targets so I would hope that a little paranoia about them would exist.

 

[Jade Tigress]

When your country is currently involved in a war, and after 9/11, I believe that awareness is necssary. Bridges, tunnels etc. are key targets so I would hope that a little paranoia about them would exist.

See, that's what I'm wondering. Like I said, I'm probably being naive, my mind just didn't go there. Perhaps I have a little too much faith in the current security of our country after 9/11 because of the way national security has been increased. I'm sure I'm the odd man out here. Or, more likely, if I had less going on in my personal life I'd be focused more on the reality of possible terrorism.

 

[michaeledward]

Didn't Michael Chertoff recently tell us his 'gut' was predicting a terrorist attack.

 

[terryl965]

I guess in this time and age we must consider every possible act, when something like this happens.

 

[theletch1]

Didn't Michael Chertoff recently tell us his 'gut' was predicting a terrorist attack.

I think his "gut" was telling him he shouldn't have had the pad thai for lunch. I didn't consider terrorism in this instance for one big reason...while it was a tragic incident it didn't have the "we want the attention of the world" flair about it that I feel an act of terrorism would have had. Yes, we should be aware of nefarious acts BEFOREHAND by using our situational awareness but jumping to the conclusion that everything out of the ordinary that happens is terrorism will soon have you cringing in your closet and afraid to go out.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

I dont believe this was terrorism either. Im just saying that in the current time period we live in, its necessary to eliminate that possibility instead of just ignoring it out of hand.

 

[14 Kempo]

Although we must be aware of terrorism, I agree with the previous post, this does not have the look of such an act. Al-Qaida has stated that they are still at war with the United States, so yes, keep your eyes open.

This was most likely a breakdown in the system, and yes, probably due to budgetary constraints. As citizens, we can jump to all kinds of conclusions, but the investigation will take place and soon the truth will come out.

 

[Kacey]

"Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't really out to get me".

Do I think that this particular bridge was chosen for terrorism? I don't know... but I would rather they consider all possibilities and dismiss them through fact-finding, than consider some possibility(ies) unlikely and miss something because it was eliminated from consideration when it shouldn't have been.

 

[MBuzzy]

Again....there haven't been too many details of the actual collapse released that I've seen....but I can say that if it was terrorism, it would be apparent VERY quickly. Taking out a bridge isn't exactly difficult, but it is obvious when it is done maliciously. From what I can tell this was a pretty standard column bridge. I mean, no hollow sections or anything as far as I saw in pictures. Which means that there are either very very large steel girders covered in concrete or columns of concrete heavily reinforced. Either way, you have multiple columns like that. Now taking out one column would cause a catastrophic failure, but you would have to cut through the column either with a big bomb (which would cause colateral damage and overpressure) or a shape charge. Shape charges are pretty easily identified....it would look like the column was basically CUT....straight through.

Now, I don't have any of the details, but the people investigating the colapse would have found these things almost immediately if it WAS a terrorist attack.

Although - the best attack is one that looks like an accident. It just seems that the terrorists that we deal with are more interested in making a political statement.

 

[Flying Crane]

One of the reasons the current regime has been so successful in furthering their goals is because they keep finding ways to "remind" us all that we need to be afraid. All the time. Evil-Doers are lurking around every corner, looking for ways to destroy your lifestyle and interfere with your ability to go shopping.

So they find ways to slip this in everywhere. Even making a statement that it DOESN'T look like the bridge collapse was linked to terrorism reminds us that it COULD have been, and we should shiver in fear at the thought. Keep being afraid.

Now I am not accusing Fire Chief Jim Clack of deliberately being a tool of the administration. But it shows how this fear and paranoia has been spread so well that good people like Mr. Clack end up reinforcing this fear and paranoia thru the normal duties of doing his job. The regime couldn't be happier about this. The good citizens are unwittingly doing their dirty work for them.

When a bridge here in the US collapses without a clear explosion or something to obviously indicate foul play, I certainly don't assume it might have been terrorist linked. If evidence of foul play surfaces during the investigation, well that's another issue. But I don't jump to that assumption automatically. Rather, I blame a lack of maintennance on our infrastructure. Maybe the 2 billion dollars per week we are spending in Iraq might be better spent making sure our infrastructure is well maintained.

 

[MBuzzy]

So they find ways to slip this in everywhere. Even making a statement that it DOESN'T look like the bridge collapse was linked to terrorism reminds us that it COULD have been, and we should shiver in fear at the thought. Keep being afraid.

I'm not saying that we should be constantly prepared, but I also sometimes think that this is the administration's way of "prepping" the people. So that if something does happen, they can say "Well, we told you so!"

We're also much more vulnerable than most people believe in my opinion....

 

[Flying Crane]

I'm not saying that we should be constantly prepared, but I also sometimes think that this is the administration's way of "prepping" the people. So that if something does happen, they can say "Well, we told you so!"

We're also much more vulnerable than most people believe in my opinion....

Good points, and yes, we certainly are vulnerable. We are a huge country, with long borders, lots of landmass, and a certain amount of anonymity. There are definitely vulnerabilities, and there always will be. It is impossible to be completely safe. I just don't see a reason to live in constant fear and paranoia. A little bit of reasonable preparation is a good idea. I have a small stock of drinking water and food supply and camping gear on hand in case we get hit with a bit earthquake here in San Francisco, and I guess that could also be some sort of terrorist attack that disrupts services and might cause an evacuation. That makes sense to me, to take that step. But a life of constant paranoia does not.

Feeding the terrorism paranoia by commenting on it without any clear evidence of foul play is just playing the regime's game for them.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

I'm not saying that we should be constantly prepared, but I also sometimes think that this is the administration's way of "prepping" the people. So that if something does happen, they can say "Well, we told you so!"

We're also much more vulnerable than most people believe in my opinion....

If it were Clinton making the same warnings it would be a different story. This isnt about "paranoia" as much as it is about party politics. Next time there is a terrorist attack it will be all "why isnt the government doing more"? We have a television attention span and menory. Its like 9/11 is ancient history already. Our forefathers battlecry was "Remember Pearl Harbor". Ours is "What did Paris Hilton do now??"

 

[Touch Of Death]

Ok, so I'm sure everyone has already heard about the bridge collapse in Minnesota.

If not, here's the article.

Tragic and another *freak* incident. What struck me was the following comment:



I know it's something that must always be considered, but I am naive? I didn't even think of terrorism in this instance until I read that. Did any of you? Am I foolish to not constantly be on the alert or is our country, for lack of a better word, paranoid?

Terrorism? Nope. It turns out it was that damn Democrat congress again.
Sean

 

[Empty Hands]

Perhaps I have a little too much faith in the current security of our country after 9/11 because of the way national security has been increased.

Sadly, security hasn't increased at all. "Security theatre" certainly has though. Nothing has been done to address the largest security holes that terrorists can attack through - container shipping and the border mainly. Meanwhile, small sheriff departments in Montana get a million or two of DHS money to buy fancy walkie-talkies and we are all forced to strip down and leave our deadly 4 oz. shampoo bottles at home in order to get on an airplane. Nevermind the fact that their never was a real liquid bomb, and that attempts to sneak weapons past airport security by federal inspectors are successful in the vast majority of attempts.

Here's a charming instance where Newark screeners failed 20 of 22 security tests.
http://consumerist.com/consumer/air...ind-hidden-weapons-in-federal-test-211044.php

Yet they still can make flying miserable. Feel safer yet?

 

[jks9199]

Are you naive? No. A little hopeful and complacent about terror? Yes.

And, speaking as a law enforcement professional, I WANT you to be able to be complacent and hopeful.

Sadly, you can't be. I remember an account from an Israeli (or at least someone who spent a lot of time in Israel) that I heard recently. There was an abandoned suitcase or briefcase left in a public area. They were amazed at how long it took for anyone to respond; in Israel, if you walk away from a package for even a few minutes, DOZENS of people are reporting it, the bomb squad is arriving... Whereas, here, I've responded to abandoned packages, looked at 'em, opened 'em up, and cursed the idiot who couldn't put their trash in the right place. Guess what? I'm LUCKY none of them ever blew up in my face.

The simple truth today is that ANY catastrophe has the potentional to be terror-related. Most aren't. But the possibility and the potential is still there.

 

[Andy Moynihan]

Are you naive? No. A little hopeful and complacent about terror? Yes.

And, speaking as a law enforcement professional, I WANT you to be able to be complacent and hopeful.

Sadly, you can't be. I remember an account from an Israeli (or at least someone who spent a lot of time in Israel) that I heard recently. There was an abandoned suitcase or briefcase left in a public area. They were amazed at how long it took for anyone to respond; in Israel, if you walk away from a package for even a few minutes, DOZENS of people are reporting it, the bomb squad is arriving... Whereas, here, I've responded to abandoned packages, looked at 'em, opened 'em up, and cursed the idiot who couldn't put their trash in the right place. Guess what? I'm LUCKY none of them ever blew up in my face.

The simple truth today is that ANY catastrophe has the potentional to be terror-related. Most aren't. But the possibility and the potential is still there.

Exactly.

To listen to the evening news, you'd think a different "sky" was falling every damn day. it's what they do. They don't know HOW to report anymore.

From face to face talks with active military/LEOs, it's becoming very gradual, but we are, bit by bit, infact, winning on all fronts, though the risk is far from gone, and you can't obsess over it anyway.

 

[jks9199]

Exactly.

To listen to the evening news, you'd think a different "sky" was falling every damn day. it's what they do. They don't know HOW to report anymore.

From face to face talks with active military/LEOs, it's becoming very gradual, but we are, bit by bit, infact, winning on all fronts, though the risk is far from gone, and you can't obsess over it anyway.

Let me clarify...

Terrorism, and the threat of terrorism, will be with us forevermore.

That doesn't, and shouldn't, mean that we are afraid of stepping out of our doors, or that every single thing that happens is terrorism related. Anymore than the fact that Mara Salvatrucha is around and has done plenty of bad things means that every group of Latinos are gang members (or substitute Bloods or Gangster Disciples for the gang, and blacks for the members... or even the Aryan Brotherhood and whites respectively... It's equal opportunity; MS just has been getting the press.).

My wish is that you could leave your doors unlocked, send your kids out to play, and generally live in the Nerf world of Happy Days or another sitcom. I wish and dream is that everyone could wander around with their heads in the clouds, beaming and happy with never a thought of terrorism.

But it ain't so.

Bad things ARE out there. Be aware of them. Respect them. Take action when they might be around. But the moment you surrender your life to them -- the bad things, be they gangs, drugs, terrorists, or even door-to-door vacuum salespeople, will have won!

I don't want the US to become like Israel, living in what amounts to an armed standoff. To achieve that, we all have to accept our responsibility for being realistically aware of the dangers around us. You wouldn't run blindly into a busy street; don't blindly assume terrorism or gangs or whatever won't happen, either. But you would cross the street at a crosswalk; don't let the fear of terror or gangs or whatever keep you from living.

 

[Marginal]

I know it's something that must always be considered, but I am naive? I didn't even think of terrorism in this instance until I read that. Did any of you? Am I foolish to not constantly be on the alert or is our country, for lack of a better word, paranoid?

Apparently the Brooklyn bridge can be dismantled overnight with a blowtorch. (At least according to the Bush it can.) I'm sure a terrorist leveling a stern gaze at a lesser structure would topple it.