As much as I like Jeff Chan, I donāt think he should have gotten the point for the 5th round. What do you guys think?
Battle of the martial arts YouTubers, episode 2
- Thread starter Tony Dismukes
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As much as I like Jeff Chan, I donāt think he should have gotten the point for the 5th round. What do you guys think?
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I think it needs to become a TV series / sport. It can be set up as individual and team competition. Then let them have at it.
Good Scenario.
That Round Robin stuff sucks. I would like to thank Atlanta Kung Fu and Sanda for introducing me to that nightmare lol. But seriously. It's really good training. My first time doing it was an eye opener for me. Now I try to get in Round Robin Training when ever I can.
I'm surprised that Jeff scored on the knife one. He got stabbed pretty bad.
J. Pickard
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He died. Period. No points should have been given. I did enjoy how he was frustrated at the guys who chose not to fight and got points for it. It reminds me of the saying "when you're a hammer everything starts to look like a nail." As a fighter he kept seeing opportunities to fight and missing the opportunities to flee.
How do you know he died?
People survive being stabbed regularly.
Three stabs to the belly - does not look like good forecast for the prediction for the future...
He could win this kind of fight in real life even wounded, but the case was not to win the fight but to stay safe.
Fine, he didn't die, he just required major surgery and whatever recovery time there was associated with that and whatever bills were associated with the medical treatment. Do you think he won versus handing the guy his wallet and walking away?
J. Pickard
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He was stabbed multiple times in the ribs, stomach, and one of them looked like it may have got his neck but it was hard to tell from the camera angle. Those are fatal wounds. Sure there is a small chance that in real life he survived, but there will likely be lasting effects. He failed to defend himself and shouldn't have gotten any points for that.
I think we should all remember the goal of self-defense, which is to minimize harm to oneself. Your goal shouldn't really be to "win" the fight, it should be to escape or survive the dangerous situation.
Yeah Jeff Chan could have "won" the fight even after taking multiple stab wounds, but it wouldn't call that good self-defense.
It can be argued that it was because it could have been worse.
Compliance often works, but compliance doesnāt guarantee safety.
So you can pinpoint how deep the wounds would have been and what organs if any would have been effected?
Again people have survived āfatalā wounds plenty.
This is an extreme example, but by comparison, 3-4 stab wounds are easily survivable.
Woman disembowelled and almost decapitated held on her own head to survive
Alison Botha was abducted near her home in South Africa on December 18, 1994. She was brutally raped, stabbed, and disembowelled - but somehow the then 27-year-old is still alive
www.dailystar.co.uk
Assuming a mugger decides to just walk away after getting what they want. Doesnāt always work that way.
Jeff chanās fight can easily be abstracted as a similar situation.
No guarantee compliance would have kept him safe. See videos I have shared in other replies.
Tigerwarrior
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The Aikido fella really impressed me.
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There are also many examples where 3-4 stab wounds with a 6 inch blade are not survivable especially in a fight, where the person who is stabbing is not counting to make sure they are only stabbing 3-4 times. There are a lot of cctv footage where one stab to the chest or to person's side was enough to victim to disengage the person attacking, only to have the stab victim walk off and die shortly after.
The thing about getting stabbed is that each stab will make you less effective as you start to bleed and as the body registers that the organs have been damaged. The life of the person literally drains and the life begins to fade away. Stabbing can be really brutal.
Self-defense stabbings tend to be those that stop once the attacker disengages. Assaults that are stabbings tend to be fueled by anger and 3-4 stabs aren't on the menu. If you are being mugged with a knife then you are already being met with aggression. The last thing you want to do is validate a reason for stabbing you.
In terms of surviving a knife attack, you don't get a say in how the attacker stabs you or how many times they attack you. Sometimes the victim gets 1 or 2 stabs, but a lot of times they don't.
The good news in a crappy situation, is that there are quite a few videos of being mugged at knife point where the victim gives up the wallet or purse and they get to live without injury. For me personally, that would be my first choice. At that point my worse case scenario would be be fighting. But I rather have that as my worse case scenario than my first choice.
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Yeah but you are looking at something totally different. Gun vs knife attack. In addition, in the videos that you showed, fighting back would have had the same outcome. Unless that gun is within arms reach, then fighting is going to be a high failure rate. Both of those guys were stuck in "no man's land" Where they were too far to physically try to control the gun and too close to escape, which was made worse because they were boxed in from the start.
Talking about knife attacks is not the same as talking about gun attacks. In addition the approaches to self-defense for both are greatly different. We used to do knife self defense in school where we could try to control the stabbing hand. Many times the attacker was able to drop the knife in the other hand and then stab the heck out of our victim.
The way that someone holds the knife will also affect how you can grab the stabbing hand. Having a broom, knife, a bat, or a chair will give you some advantages against a knife that you won't have with a gun as shown in the videos you posted.
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When I teach self defense. I teach to comply in a way that doesn't put you in a worse situation. For example, if someone has a knife and tells me to hop in the car next to us, or tells me to go down an alley or some place out of site of the general public. Just the suggestion of those things tells me that they aren't really interested in taking my wallet.
Regardless of the weapon. The goal is not to not let things get worse. If you have a knife held to your next but haven't been cut yet, then you are in a good position. If you can maintain the "I haven't been cut yet" through the entire incident then you are doing well.
If you have been stabbed once, then you don't want to want to maintain that status of "being stabbed once" and hopefully you only get stabbed in a non vital area. Being stabbed 37 times means things kept getting worse literally 37 times worse.
In my mind, anyone who got stabbed shouldn't have won that point, largely because they had the ability (whether or not they realized it) to get away with no fight at all. When they are asked to give their money, they made a choice not to, and got stabbed as a result.
Something else I noticed, is that the ones who won the 2v1 round that started with the RNC; everyone who won that round reacted before it got set in. Everyone who took a second to react lost because it was already sunk in and they had a tougher time escaping.
That's why no-mind drills are so important.
Something else I noticed, is that the ones who won the 2v1 round that started with the RNC; everyone who won that round reacted before it got set in. Everyone who took a second to react lost because it was already sunk in and they had a tougher time escaping.
That's why no-mind drills are so important.
Wing Woo Gar
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I was stabbed in the face and ribs when I was 20. I was lucky. There was a plastic surgeon resident at the hospital who put my ear back where it belongs. I did not receive any points, as it should be. I also was not on a bus, so there is that. My two cents on this is that a city bus looks nothing like that. It has metal bars and hard seats and a rear door pit.
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Those who won probably know what a RNC feels like. They probably have a good sense of what it feels like before it sets in. Those who don't know what it feels like probably didn't know what was going on until it set in. When I grapple, I can sense what my training partner is trying to do before it's actually done. This is why it's so important to train against other systems. I would say that there is a great deal of mental activity and sensory activity going on. Every point of contact paints a picture of what is going on and how the technique is being positioned. This allows you to accurately predict "what's next." You can almost visualize it in a split second.
Those who don't recognize the "feel of a RNC" before it's applied are either not thinking, because to them the sensory touch and position of the arms and hands probably don't have meaning for them yet. Or, their minds are thinking too much in an effort to try to determine what is going on. Think of it like solving a computer problem. When you know what is going on then you are able to react fast and solve the problem fast. When you don't know what's going on, then the brain over analyzes as it makes an attempt to try understand the problem and find a solution.
In fighting or sparring you have to
1. Understand what's coming at you
2. Have a known solution.
Any over-analysis on either of these two areas will cause a delay in your ability to respond. The same is true for someone trying to apply a technique as well. People who are learning a new technique are slower to apply it because they are spending a lot of time over-analyzing.
