Arn't these the bad guys?

[jetboatdeath]

Tuesday, January 27th, 2009 at 12:00 am
Unexpected Urgent Refugee and Migration Needs Related to Gaza

MEMORANDUM FOR THE SECRETARY OF STATE

SUBJECT: Unexpected Urgent Refugee and Migration Needs Related to Gaza

By the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States, including section 2(c)(1) of the Migration and Refugee Assistance Act of 1962 (the "Act"), as amended (22 U.S.C. 2601), I hereby determine, pursuant to section 2(c)(1) of the Act, that it is important to the national interest to furnish assistance under the Act in an amount not to exceed $20.3 million from the United States Emergency Refugee and Migration Assistance Fund for the purpose of meeting unexpected and urgent refugee and migration needs, including by contributions to international, governmental, and nongovernmental organizations and payment of administrative expenses of the Bureau of Population, Refugees, and Migration of the Department of State, related to humanitarian needs of Palestinian refugees and conflict victims in Gaza.

You are authorized and directed to publish this memorandum in the Federal Register.

BARACK OBAMA

THE WHITE HOUSE,
January 27, 2009

 

[Blindside]

Yes, any person living in or fleeing from a residence in the Gaza strip should be identified as a "bad guy." :disgust:

 

[MA-Caver]

Bad guys are determined by whose side you and they are on...
Remember, Saddam was a good guy... fighting a common enemy known as Iran. Osama Bin Laden gotten help from the U.S. fighting the Soviets.

The list goes on.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Why would they be "bad guys"?
Because they are Palestinian?

 

[jarrod]

no, bob. because they're brown.

jf

 

[tellner]

Good guys vs. Bad guys is the wrong way to look at it. There's a lot of people there. Some of them, even ones you like, are bad people. Some of them, even ones you don't like, are good people.

What's really important is that they all have agendas and interests. And the vast majority are just trying to get by in really difficult circumstances. "When Princes fight," goes the saying "Peasants die." That includes Israelis, Gazans and everyone else.

I'm as hard-core a Zionist as you're likely to find. That doesn't mean that the Arabs living in Gaza or the West Bank are evil. It means that I want them to stop shooting missles at my relatives and blowing themselves up in pizza parlors. Until their stateless limbo is resolved one way or another that's not going to happen. I would like the Israelis to stop turning Gaza into a blood-soaked parking lot. Until Hamas stops the above and gets beyond "Totenjude!" as its entire foreign policy that won't happen either. No matter how it happened or why it continues the humanitarian situation in Gaza is abominable and not getting any better. Food, water, medicine, housing and basic utilities are vital.

And none of it is going to get any better as long as Israel is a useful villain for most of the Muslim world or as long as the Arabs, Persians, Israelis and outside powers play their proxy power games.

 

[tellner]

Yes, any person living in or fleeing from a residence in the Gaza strip should be identified as a "bad guy."

The Israelis think so. The Egyptians think so. Forty years ago after the Black September the Syrians thought so when the Jordanians who thought so were tossing refugees out of Jordan.

 

[seasoned]

Whoever is pulling the trigger is the bad guy, whoever is not pulling the trigger is the good guy. The biggest problem is, we can’t tell them apart.

 

[Sukerkin]

Interesting point, Seasoned.

Things used to be so much simpler in the miltary-political game when the sides would have armies and meet at agreed fields of battle to sort the winner out . Still not a great way of doing 'business' but better than having combatants in amongst the general population and then using their casualties as a raison d'etre for keeping the endless fight going.

 

[theletch1]

Interesting point, Seasoned.

Things used to be so much simpler in the miltary-political game when the sides would have armies and meet at agreed fields of battle to sort the winner out . Still not a great way of doing 'business' but better than having combatants in amongst the general population and then using their casualties as a raison d'etre for keeping the endless fight going.

See, that's why I consider you much more eloquent than myself. I was simply gonna say that the above was a gross over simplification of reality. There are times when the trigger MUST be pulled. Granted, it depends on which side of the fence you're sitting on as to who's the good guy and who's the bad but pulling a trigger doesn't automatically make you a bad guy.

 

[searcher]

I think someone has been watching the door-gunner on Full Metal Jacket again. I agree that it used to be easier to decide who was the enemy and who was not, but why are WE(United States) taking on their refugees? I don't see a bunch of their neighbors, who also hate the Israeli Nation, jumping in to help. And we are allies with Israel, not the Palestinians.

In the middle of an economic crisis, we dump more money into the deficit.

I don't agree in callingthem BGs, but come on. It is time we worried about our own country and less about the others. They think we should not mess with their affairs at other times, why should we now? Lets not.

 

[seasoned]

See, that's why I consider you much more eloquent than myself. I was simply gonna say that the above was a gross over simplification of reality. There are times when the trigger MUST be pulled. Granted, it depends on which side of the fence you're sitting on as to who's the good guy and who's the bad but pulling a trigger doesn't automatically make you a bad guy.

Sorry, I know things are not always black and white, in the sense of being easily distinguishable. I understand what you are saying, or what you were going to say, but for all intent and purposes, whether an individual, or a country, there is no time to sort out who and why someone is “pulling the trigger” because once it is pulled, you are the enemy, for that point in time.
And, yes, I must agree wholeheartedly that Sukerkin does speak with eloquence , and indeed puts his thoughts together very well. :asian:

 

[Cryozombie]

The way I originally saw this article it stated:

"Obama Signs Presidentail Determination Allowing Palestinians Loyal to Hamas to Resettle in US"

I could see where some people, if that was the source of the information that they recieved would think it was about letting the "Bad Guys" come here.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

The way I originally saw this article it stated:

"Obama Signs Presidentail Determination Allowing Palestinians Loyal to Hamas to Resettle in US"

I could see where some people, if that was the source of the information that they recieved would think it was about letting the "Bad Guys" come here.

But that's not what was posted here. If it had been, it would be a different discussion.

 

[Cryozombie]

But that's not what was posted here. If it had been, it would be a different discussion.

But, it was sitting on his desk when I got into work this morning, which Is why I bring it up.

Besides, we know how that different discussion would go:

"Mumble mumble, stupid biased republicans just want obama to fail, blame fox news"

LOL.

 

[MA-Caver]

Why would they be "bad guys"?
Because they are Palestinian?

no, Bob. because they're brown.

jf

:lol:
Reminds me of a Carlin monologue based on the idea that the U.S. loves bombing brown people."http://www.milkandcookies.com/link/113389/detail/ (caution language).

 

[theletch1]

no, bob. because they're brown.

jf

Does that argument hold water anymore? I thought we proved to the world just how great we were... how open minded we were... how much like them we were when we elected Obama (a somewhat brown guy himself).

 

[David Weatherly]

Bad guys are determined by whose side you and they are on...
Remember, Saddam was a good guy... fighting a common enemy known as Iran. Osama Bin Laden gotten help from the U.S. fighting the Soviets.

The list goes on.

Well said Caver.

 

[tellner]

Letch, while I applaud the election of Obama, not least because it shows that a Democrat doesn't have to be from the South to be President, you're over simplifying a touch. Benazir Bhutto and Indira Gandhi were women. Their elections were significant, but that didn't make Pakistan and India models of equality.

All of these are significant steps. They are not proof that everything is suddenly perfect.

 

[theletch1]

My response was aimed more at my personal exasperation at every action of America being because someone was "brown" than any idea I may (or not) have about the election of Obama and race relations in this country. His election didn't change anything.... it was changes beforehand that made his election possible at all. I simply grow tired of the argument of race for nearly every item that pops up.