A Beginner's Doubts

[K' Evans]

Hi there, this is my first post. I only recently found this forum after taking up martial arts couple of months back, and am pleased to see how vibrant and responsive this board is. I am hoping to hang ard and learn more from everyone here.

Just thought I introduce myself briefly before I go into the main content of my first post. I am ard 25 years old, and have just taken up Jeet Kune Do (JKD) a few months ago, then along with Kali just a month back. I have always been interested in martial arts as a kid, but aside from a couple of years in TKD as a kid, I never participated in it seriously. It was only after a few years of engaging in a fairly active lifestyle of cardio and weight-lifting, that I decided to go farther and engage in martial arts. In a way, I am catching up on my lost years as a "youth".

Anyway, although it has only been a few months, I am starting to experience some doubts in myself in JKD and Kali. I hope this is a pretty common experience and I am interested to see what you guys have to say. So far, I have narrowed down the reasons to the following:

1) Slight Discomfort with Teacher
I won't name my teacher for now, but suffice to say, he has extensive experience in martial arts and is a very reputable person in the MA world. He is definitely friendly and knowledgable, and I get along with him alright. However, I was quite stressed with him in my last few lessons. Being a beginner in a class with ppl who have backgrounds in MA (will explain this more), I get 'marked' or criticised quite a bit. Although he knows that I have no experience in MA, his...manner of teaching me somehow seems to assume that I should have known the small details of a particular technique, e.g. I didn't know that to deliver a knee strike, my foot had to be angled in a way. In a few instances (not at me directly), he would say, "I don't want to sound like an idiot but you should...." or "Are you paying attention?".

I can understand the rationale for being "tough" in class, and I guess when someone has experience in teaching SWAT team police members or etc, their character in teaching has hardened. Though I can laugh it off sometimes, it can be stressful.

2) Irregular Class Schedule
Due to the popularity of my teacher, he travels quite extensively. Thus, our classes have been quite irregular. Also, within the class, the beginners tend to drop out very quickly, and I have not seen one consistent newcomer in a few months. Though I enjoy the small class size, and I am getting along with the regulars (who may also be inconsistent at times), my teacher has mentioned a few times that he can't deliver a proper curriculum, thus he has to travel to other countries to make his living. Things may change in the future, but certainly it makes it all the more impt that I have to train myself in times of absence. This is also another compounding problem as I don't have enough space in my apartment to hang a punching bag. All I can perform currently is shadow-boxing and air-kicking (which I've read is bad).

3) Feel Old
Feeling "old" is all relative, of course, and though my classmates can be older than me, I really feel bad at myself for not taking up MA earlier. Now I can't stretch or kick high, and I really wonder how far I can advance despite my commitment. Initially, I wanted to improve and get myself to a standard that's at least competitor-level, but now I wonder if I really can considering my age and late entry into MA.

4) Interest in Other Arts
Finally, I am also interested in learning other arts, but I am unsure of what's compatible with JKD. I enjoy Kali, but I am also interested in taking up Aikido and some other form of Karate (Kyokushin seems most appealing for now). Given that I have more time to cross-train (since JKD classes are inconsistent), I think I should but I am uncertain what's compatible and if I am killing myself by taking up so much. So far, one of my classmates has suggested I take a trial class with Wushu, and he recommends Wushu for the conditioning. Somehow I also believe that I am looking at other MAs because I am seeking a supportive community. My JKD class is fine but I would hardly describe it as mutually supportive as I still feel like an 'outsider'.

Well, that's about it. Apologises for the first long post. Nevertheless, I wanted to explain myself clearly to facilitate a good intro. While I won't quit JKD, I really hope I can surpass these lingering doubts and questions in myself. Hope to hear from you guys!

 

[Blindside]

1. Your teacher may not be the nicest guy ever, fine, is he a good teacher? A good coach isn't necessarily your buddy, he is there to push you, not be your friend.

2. Irregular class schedules can be tough, try to get some training partners among the other guys in class and see if they want to get together outside of class. They are in the same boat as you.

3. You are 25 years old, repeat after me, "I am NOT too old."

4. If I had to think of the least compatible martial art to JKD, wushu just might qualify. If you aren't having fun or want something different go ahead and try it. You may find a "supportive community" in another forum, but it also may be that you haven't proved yourself to your current school.

Lamont

 

[still learning]

Hello, It sounds like you want to train and learn the martial arts? Suggestion is to find one that fits you and your schedule.

Try Kempo schools or maybe even JUDO! Finding a good teacher..one that respects you and you have respect for is VERY important here.

If you have any doubts about your school style of training (language and the way they treat you? If you are not happy....imagine been there forever? NOT a happy camper here!!

There are so many martial art schools....FIND ONE...that fits you....mostly a teacher that respects your learning skills and development.

This is something you want to be an enjoyable experience....NOT something you feel terrible about going too!

Change is always good for something like this........Aloha

 

[Kacey]

First, welcome, and happy posting! :wavey: Have you considered posting a "hello" thread in the Meet & Greet?

Second, Blindside has made some really good points, so I am going to build on that.

1. I am an instructor, and many of my students are friends of mine - but inside the dojang, that does not matter - I am there to push them into performing better, not to be their friend. That said, however, while I do provide both positive and negative feedback, I strive to make sure that it is always constructive - that is, "you need to change this so this will work better" - rather than destructive - that is, "why can't you understand/predict/know things I haven't taught you, you must be an idiot".

2. When I decided I want to start a class of my own, I sat down with my instructor and discussed it with him. He gave me some very good advice, which I try to follow to this day. One thing that he strongly emphasized is that, as the instructor, I have a responsibility to be there every class, and to provide coverage for those rare occasions when I could not be present. I have missed my class 6 times in the last 2 years - and 4 of those times involved extremely bad weather that caused me to cancel class; the other two were for a TKD camp I was an instructor at, and I made sure I had a guest instructor present to run the class. If I am going to be responsible for your learning, I must set the example of being present to teach - illness, travel, family, other responsibilities, etc, notwithstanding - else how can I expect you to show up to learn? If your instructor does not place a premium on his own presence, why should any of his students place a premium on being present? Were I you, I would look into other classes - because if having students were truly important to him, he'd be there for all of you. His other students don't show up consistently because he has set the standard - and the standard is to be inconsistent. This is not fair to you as a student.

3. Can't add much to that one - I know plenty of people who started in their 40s and 50s, and a few in their 60s. 25 is not old.

4. Look around for another school. If this one suited you, you would not be having these concerns. It must suit some of the students, because they keep coming back - but I'd look around for a better fit. If you have a particular style of MA in mind, look around that type of MA - otherwise, I'd suggest looking for a school that has a more consistent schedule. As you look around, talk to the instructor, talk to the students, and see where you feel comfortable - in the long run, comfort is more important for staying with an art than the type of MA - because if you're not comfortable in the class, you won't be likely to stay, no matter how much you like the style, instructor, location, etc.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

 

[exile]

First, welcome, and happy posting! :wavey: Have you considered posting a "hello" thread in the Meet & Greet?

Second, Blindside has made some really good points, so I am going to build on that.

1. I am an instructor, and many of my students are friends of mine - but inside the dojang, that does not matter - I am there to push them into performing better, not to be their friend. That said, however, while I do provide both positive and negative feedback, I strive to make sure that it is always constructive - that is, "you need to change this so this will work better" - rather than destructive - that is, "why can't you understand/predict/know things I haven't taught you, you must be an idiot".

2. When I decided I want to start a class of my own, I sat down with my instructor and discussed it with him. He gave me some very good advice, which I try to follow to this day. One thing that he strongly emphasized is that, as the instructor, I have a responsibility to be there every class, and to provide coverage for those rare occasions when I could not be present. I have missed my class 6 times in the last 2 years - and 4 of those times involved extremely bad weather that caused me to cancel class; the other two were for a TKD camp I was an instructor at, and I made sure I had a guest instructor present to run the class. If I am going to be responsible for your learning, I must set the example of being present to teach - illness, travel, family, other responsibilities, etc, notwithstanding - else how can I expect you to show up to learn? If your instructor does not place a premium on his own presence, why should any of his students place a premium on being present? Were I you, I would look into other classes - because if having students were truly important to him, he'd be there for all of you. His other students don't show up consistently because he has set the standard - and the standard is to be inconsistent. This is not fair to you as a student.

3. Can't add much to that one - I know plenty of people who started in their 40s and 50s, and a few in their 60s. 25 is not old.

4. Look around for another school. If this one suited you, you would not be having these concerns. It must suit some of the students, because they keep coming back - but I'd look around for a better fit. If you have a particular style of MA in mind, look around that type of MA - otherwise, I'd suggest looking for a school that has a more consistent schedule. As you look around, talk to the instructor, talk to the students, and see where you feel comfortable - in the long run, comfort is more important for staying with an art than the type of MA - because if you're not comfortable in the class, you won't be likely to stay, no matter how much you like the style, instructor, location, etc.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

Everything that Kacey said!

Just to help drive the age point home: I'm on the very edge of 60—next month—and started TKD just under four years ago. Like you I did, and do, a lot of cardio and heavy weight training. I've never felt stronger or quicker in my life, and I have to say, it's really important for you to drop any self-doubt you have based on age, because you've got thirty years on people like me, and if we can do it at all, at 25 you can do it in your sleep!

What counts, more than anything else, is will and desire. If those are strong enough, you can become good, even very good, at virtually anything. To be brilliant, a true virtuoso, requires something a little extra, some special quirk or talent, but solid competence... no problem, if you want it badly enough and work hard enough. At twenty-five you've got the world at your feet...

 

[Shawn]

I teach a JKD and Kali class, and I manage to do it in a very friendly atmosphere without the need to berate my students. I've trained in the Dojo/Dojang atmosphere, but much prefer the family feel of a friendly club where the students own desire pushes them. That is a personal preference. There are many people who love having someone yell at them and motivate them with a "tough love" or "military" approach. Find a place that has an atmosphere you enjoy and thrive in.

If you don't enjoy the classes you won't be consistant in your training, and consistant training is one of the most important factors in the martial arts.

As for the missed classes, I don't see a need for that. You instructor should arrange to have someone (a senior student perhaps) cover the class when he is not there...once again to maintain consistant training.

My mother recently had some health issues that required me to miss 3 classes in a two week period. I was able to get my own instructor to come and cover one class, I also arranged for an instructor from a different system to come in to cover the other two classes which gave my students a chance to cross-train.

If your instructor is away doing seminars I take it he has a "name" in the martial arts and it might be worth putting up with what you don't like in order to get the quality of instruction provided when he IS there. If that is the case I would look at his classes as a supplement to my regular training - and look for somewhere else to get that regular training.

As for feeling old I'm hitting 40 this year, I have a student who is 65, Dan Inosanto is 70 and still going strong. 25 is not too late to develope flexibility and strength. Maybe start taking a yoga class. In JKD and Kali high kicking isn't needed or stressed. Kali has a whole sub-system based on low-line kicking, and JKD really doesn't have a need for kicks higher than groin. Kick the legs and groin.

You mentioned something about wanted to be competitive level - what sort of competition? Kickboxing? MMA? Thai? BJJ? Forms? WEKAF?

I know guys who have started around your age and gone on to compete in one or more of the above after 2 years or so of training - sometimes less. That still gives you a few competitive years in the ring - Randy retired at 42.

Shawn

 

[ArmorOfGod]

From what I read, this is pretty cut and dry. Leave there and find somewhere that you are more comfortable with.
Don't let anyone tell you to "try karate" or "try judo." Just go try everything in your area. Many "karate" teachers teach what looks more like a grappling class. Many "taekwondo" teachers teach more punching than tkd typically would. Each instructor has their own flavor to what they teach, so you just have to go see how each local teacher teaches and see what kind of atmosphere is in the room.

AoG

 

[K' Evans]

Wow, thanks everyone for the replies. Been enlightening to read and put some thought into it. Here's my response:

1) Regarding Instructor
I don't have any doubts that my Sifu is a very good teacher, with lots of experience and knowledge behind him. And I also know that our relationship doesn't have to be all "buddy-buddy" or become a "coffee-mate". He is nice but he does have a macho streak in him. But in reflecting on Blindside's query if he is a good teacher, my answer is mixed. My honest answer is that he can be a better teacher, and I don't mean it in an offensive manner. He certainly can teach and answer our questions, but I do think one of the reasons most new-comers drop out so soon is that he doesn't take a serious interest in developing their potential. All the new-comers usually find it difficult to learn the funamental techniques of the on-guard stance, straight-lead and hook kick and I think if he were able to encourage them that it would take time to train in them, I think the new-comers will at least consider staying longer. As an example, I told him early on that I would like him to assess me regularly, but he doesn't really do it and instead, I have to initiate going to him (his reply was that "oh yeah, JKD suits you."). Maybe the time period is too short for assessment, so in all fairness, I may be wrong in this aspect.

I guess another reason is that being our class is small, not all the seniors welcome new students wholeheartedly. I don't claim to be the most friendly and I am certainly not the most senior, but I usually welcome any new-comers more wholeheartedly than the seniors. And I do this because I know how intimidating it can be to be taught a MA without being properly psyched about it. In fact, initially for some time, I was uncomfortable with one of the seniors cos I didn't know why he wouldn't greet or speak to me. It was only recently when he conducted a class in substitute for my Sifu that we got along better.

2) Regarding Class
I am glad everyone brought out the issue abt training with the other students during the instructor's absence. I should have mentioned this earlier but as I just joined recently, I only got to know about this particular class habit. Apparently, pretty much most of the students hardly have the motivation to train together if my Sifu is not around. To be fair, it was the holiday season (December 2006) but my classmates have told me that it is rare for the class to get together and train. I have tried talking to one of my better classmates and I am hoping to train with one of the seniors but I am not sure if they see the point in training in pairs.

That being said, I don't mind this particular aspect as long as I believe that I can train on my own with accomplishable improvements and results.

3) Being Old
Okay, I said this was relative. But I get the point from you guys. I think it's a sense of regret in myself that I didn't take MA earlier. One of my classmates is a 18year old guy who is competing in ameteur boxing and Muay Thai (i.e. he took up Muay Thai since our JKD classes were so inconsistent). I simply wish I was in his shoes instead. Don't have to be a national competitor, I'd be happy if I could engage in small local ameutuer competitions.

The other funny thing, for me, is that sure, there are older guys ard and also they take up MA at a later age than I did. But I don't know, it feels different for me. I guess I would like to accomplish something in the MA world, and I wonder if other ppl are going to say, "You started way too late to make something for yourself". It's different to compare a respectable master and excellent martial artist like Dan Inosanto who is in his 70s, but has done MAs all his life.

That being said, I understand what everyone is saying. I don't want to let it get me down, and I have to accept that I can't turn back the clock anymore. Better than I realised this sooner than later. Even if I can't do splits, I will try anyway.

4) Looking at Other Schools
Unfortunately, there is no other JKD instructor around. And further, as Shawn mentions, my Sifu definitely has a "name" and I don't want to be become another statistic in his "dropped out" list of newcomers. Further, for all his "faults", I respect him and think it is an honour to be taught by him.

So, I will continue with JKD despite the difficulties but I don't know if I am making the right decision or mindset to consider adding another MA into my repertoire. Much has been said and debated about the idea of cross-training when one doesn't have a solid foundation in one particular MA but I don't know if I can obtain a solid foundation in JKD in the current scenario. I get very mixed responses to this, like e.g. my classmate telling me that mixing JKD with Muay Thai is inconsistent, but yet some posters in the JKD forum here do that.

So yeah, what do you make of my situation?

 

[exile]

Good post, KE!

Being Old
Okay, I said this was relative. But I get the point from you guys. I think it's a sense of regret in myself that I didn't take MA earlier.

Oh yes, I know the feeling...

 

[K' Evans]

Yeah, you get what I mean, exile. It's just a terrible feeling. It's like discovering you had a gift/talent for drawing (not that I have a talent in MA, mind you) but realised it too late. Like I said, it's just the sense of regret for not being brave enough to pursue my passion earlier, and now I am doing what I can to "make up" for it.

 

[Kacey]

Yeah, you get what I mean, exile. It's just a terrible feeling. It's like discovering you had a gift/talent for drawing (not that I have a talent in MA, mind you) but realised it too late. Like I said, it's just the sense of regret for not being brave enough to pursue my passion earlier, and now I am doing what I can to "make up" for it.

There's nothing wrong with starting past childhood and wishing you'd started sooner - just remember that, one, you can't start any sooner than you did, as the past is immutable, and two, the fact that you started at all puts you a step ahead of all of the people who sit there and think how cool it would be if they could just work up the guts to start... never mind all the people who never even think about it. If it helps any, I started at 20... and my 20th anniversary with my own sahbum is this week.

 

[exile]

Yeah, you get what I mean, exile. It's just a terrible feeling. It's like discovering you had a gift/talent for drawing (not that I have a talent in MA, mind you) but realised it too late. Like I said, it's just the sense of regret for not being brave enough to pursue my passion earlier, and now I am doing what I can to "make up" for it.

But here's the thing, K'E—you have all the time in the world, if you just use it right. I started MA in my later mid-fifties. I'm going to be testing for Dan sometime in the next 18 months, given where I am now. I'm in unusually good shape for someone my age, or even ten years younger; but my horizons in MA are still very limited, and who knows what lies ahead just around the next corner? But you have almost unlimited prospects. It's really true. There are very few opportunities you're deprived of in the MAs now that would have been open to you had you started ten years earlier. In fact, you're most definitely in better shape now to do something excellent in the MAs than a lot of kids who started at age 12 and burned out at 18 or so.

See, this is the problem: everyone thinks in terms of a trajectory like Midori. Started at 3, a virtuoso at 6, a supernatural phenomenon by her early teens... and now, in her 30s, one of the all-time greatest violinists ever. I've heard her in concert, she's like a visitation from the Realm Angelic... but for every prodigy like her, there are probably dozens, maybe equally talented, who quit after ten years, who've had enough and want out—I've seen statistical models of the frequency of unusual talent; it's not as unusual as people think, but a lot of the exponents of that talent drop out early enough that you don't hear about them. I've known at least two kids who were close to International Master ranking in chess in their teens who decided after a while that they had better things to do with their time. So now back to your case: your complaint about starting too late really doesn't have much teeth if you're talking just about having begun MA when you were 20 instead of 25—5 years makes little difference, right? It only makes sense if you're talking at least 10, maybe 15 years. So say you'd started at 10. You might have wound up the next Chuck Norris or Bruce Lee. But you also might have quit at 18, decided you wanted something totally different in life—say, the violin (and then bemoaned the fact that you hadn't started that when you were 10, instead of MA :wink1: ...)

You see what I'm saying? You can't know that you'd have been able to do anything more in the MA field, if you'd started fifteen years ago, than you can do now; the odds are good that you'd have dropped out—not certain, but good enough that it's probably at least even money. Or you might have stayed in, but had it grow routine on you, till after a decade or two it became like brushing your teeth... That happens too.

My advice to you is, be glad you're starting in the MAs now, when you have a good half century of active participation ahead of you (given our relatively tremendous lifespans, our knowledge of nutrition and exercise and their effect on our quality of life, and our medical technology). Be glad you didn't wait until fairly close to the canonical retirement to get into the game. You should be happy you have all these chances... I mean it; I'd switch places with you in a heartbeat, and I'm not the only one.... At 25, you really shouldn't have any regrets yet!

 

[K' Evans]

Haha, that's definitely one enlightening post. I appreciate that very much, exile. And also my thanks to everyone else who has attempted to headbutt some sense into me.

Actually, knowing that ppl like Kacey and others have started their MAs in their adult years is quite reassuring. I don't want to raise my hopes that I would be anything comparable to a Chuck Norris or Bruce Lee, and I do agree with exile that there may have been individuals who are gifted or talented but are not recognised. But you are right, that the opportunities for me to learn MA at an earlier age, for one reason or another, never presented itself, and I suppose there's no shame in that. At least, I am taking it up now and have an opportunity to nurture myself in this endeavour.

 

[exile]

Haha, that's definitely one enlightening post. I appreciate that very much, exile. And also my thanks to everyone else who has attempted to headbutt some sense into me.

Actually, knowing that ppl like Kacey and others have started their MAs in their adult years is quite reassuring. I don't want to raise my hopes that I would be anything comparable to a Chuck Norris or Bruce Lee, and I do agree with exile that there may have been individuals who are gifted or talented but are not recognised. But you are right, that the opportunities for me to learn MA at an earlier age, for one reason or another, never presented itself, and I suppose there's no shame in that. At least, I am taking it up now and have an opportunity to nurture myself in this endeavour.

You are actually in a better position, in some respects, than had you started earlier, K'E.

For one thing, physiologically/biomechanically, you're still very close to where you were in your late teens, and if you adopt a good workout routine now, you can stay in peak condition for the next decade and more. We now know that a lot of the post-30 decline people experience in their physical condition is the result of their losing the metabolic advantage of (post)adolescence and not compensating for those metabolic changes with cardio and resistance training. If you take steps to keep in top shape, you have a very long period still ahead of you where your physical capabilities will be more than a match for any MA challenges you have to face.

And for another thing, you now have something which you almost certainly didn't have a decade ago: the ability to take a long view of things, set intermediate goals and be satisfied to achieve them, trusting to time to bring you your ultimate goals. That's a crucial part of MAs. So all things considered, I'd say you're maybe in the best situation imaginable.

 

[K' Evans]

Thanks, exile. I didn't expect to get such an uplifting answer from a forum, but your pt of view definitely helped. I don't think I am physiogically/biomechanically close to my late teens , but I will make do with whatever abilities I have now. On the other hand, your last statement about being able to take a mature and calculative long-term view of my future is probably my greatest "weapon", and could help me carry on into the MAs.

 

[charyuop]

I strated Aikido last November. I am now in the fourth month and still feel like at the first day. Aikido can be pretty frustrating to learn, but if you get to like the Art like I do, you will want to continue.
What gets hurt usually in students is their pride. It is hard to be continuosly be called in front of the others because doing the technique wrong. You retry and wrong again, here Sensei comes again...he might act rough or kind with you still hurt your pride. Personally, more than the pride, it hurts me coz it seems to me that I am wasting Sensei time and in the past I could tell when in few occasions he lost his patience...even if he kept calm you could tell by the way he threw me hee hee.
After 4 months it seems I am slowly starting to understand some of the basics and Sensei I guess learnt to know me better and managed to understand the correct way to teach me (I am really lucky to have such a wonderful Sensei). You might have to give time to your Sifu or might have to learn to accept his way of teaching if you really like what he has to teach you.

I don't know if your Sifu is from Asia or a Western Sifu, but that has alot to do with the teaching. Western mentality is continuosly tormented by question like "why", "how come", "what if" and others, while an Oriental Sifu is used to the way of teching like "I show you and you student repeat exactly the way I do and you have to learn the Art just by watching".

Even tho I started MA late and I got to love Aikido (I can't wait to next class to come, I am addicted to it), I don't regret the fact that I started it now. Look behind you and see the way you lived your life and you will see that you will find things that were worth experiencing. MA is just a new experience to be lived and enjoyed.

Oh, one last thing. Since no MA experience and being new to JKD, I would suggest you learn the basics of one MA very well before thinking about cross training coz it might create a big confusion. But if you really want to cross train I would talk to your Sifu and see together a MA which can walk along with yours, which is not the complete opposite so that it will mess your learning up for both Arts.

 

[exile]

Thanks, exile. I didn't expect to get such an uplifting answer from a forum, but your pt of view definitely helped.

Most forums, probably not. But as I've noticed, and you will too, MT is quite unusual in that people who participate in it see it as a real community and want to use their experience on behalf of other members, to the extent they can. I'm a relative newcomer to MAs myself, but some of our members have been doing MAs, teaching them and thinking about them, and how people can best learn them and train them, for decades. They have a lot to offer.

I don't think I am physiogically/biomechanically close to my late teens , but I will make do with whatever abilities I have now.

That's the important thing. And you may find that, if you do some dedicated strength/cardio conditioning, that you really aren't that far from where you were at 18. The big metabolic dropoff seems to hit in the early 30s—that's the point where the body seems to downshift on its own. Up to that point, you're anatomically and metabolically in peak condition, but a lot of people let that go to waste by becoming increasingly sedentary—this often happens when people are out of school and there aren't organized sports around and peer groups for whom those sports are regular group activities. The rust that sets in then is a bit different from what happens to you later, because you can get back into good shape much more easily at that point.

You're very wise to be starting MAs now, because if you train hard, you can actually compensate for the body's slow-down that you'll encounter sometime after 30—you can actually be in better shape if you approach the problem aggressively, get in both cardio and resistance training to protect muscle man and keep your metabolism revved. People used to believe that muscle atrophy after 30 was simply inevitable, part of our genetic program, but it's not true—a good workout routine can stave it off almost indefinitely. Joints and connective tissue... well, that's another story, but even so, strong muscles make it easier on the joints. Not something you need to worry about for a long, long time in any case.

On the other hand, your last statement about being able to take a mature and calculative long-term view of my future is probably my greatest "weapon", and could help me carry on into the MAs.

Absolutely, this is true. Knowledge, understanding and discipline are at least as important as athletic ability in MA success. But the most important thing of all, in my own personal belief, is will. If you want something and refuse to be deflected from it, you will achieve it... a lot of the people I know who are extremely successful at what they do are talented, but not any more so than other talented people who fell by the wayside. They just were hungrier, I guess, and stayed that way...

 

[K' Evans]

Thanks for the replies! Here's my response:

charyuop:

Congrats on starting Aikido! I also hope to start taking it up too soon. Regarding what you said abt hurting your pride and feeling disappointed to make mistakes in front of your Sensei, that's exactly how I feel too. You put it in better words than I did, but exactly, I feel bad for having my Sifu come over and show me the techniques again and again. He knows I am trying and he tells me to relax and not get stressed, and though I don't feel that I am particularly agitated, I am starting to feel the tension for being shown the correct technique a few times. I do concede with your advice that I may need to take some time to accept his way of teaching. Maybe it will get better in the future, and I certainly hope it will, cos I don't want to feel antagonistic towards my Sifu whom I still respect.

Well, the ethnicity of the Sifu doesn't matter, but in Kali, he does suggest that I try to imitate his moves. I couldn't do it cos he was waving the sticks too well, and the hand movements were too elaborate. However, in a subsequent class, a senior student was able to teach me cos he slowed down the movements and showed it to me. Upon reflection, I was kinda disappointed that my Sifu didn't try to take his time to teach me. The technique could obviously be taught, even if I didn't manage to imitate him.

I have asked my Sifu about the idea of cross-training. Actually his answer is interesting. He obviously cautioned against it, given that I have no prior experience in the MA. And further, I should be strategic about it, he recommended that after having a solid base in JKD, I should consider a grappling art since theoretically JKD is weaker in that aspect. Now my Sifu is a master in like 7 different MAs, so I asked him about his experience. He said that if he had to do it all over again, he wouldn't have taken so much; he found some of it redundant, and he would have taken up gymnatics or yoga! Simply cos he wasn't in the right condition when he took up MA in his youth so yoga or gymnatics would have actually complemented his MA training.

My problem is that I don't really have a serious interest in any grappling art for now. Also, for some reason, he wasn't so certain abt taking BJJ, either cos he found it too sports-oriented or maybe the schools around our area teach it in that approach. I also know that in his opinion, he wouldn't mix JKD with Muay Thai but when one of my classmates showed interest in taking up Muay Thai, my Sifu just told him to go ahead. I was quite baffled but my guess is that he knew that student was going to do it anyway. Further, our classes are not as consistent as it is now.

However, I remember that in a few of our classes, my Sifu was showing us some wrist-lockdown and grappling technique. Oddly enough, he did comment that an Aikido or Jujitsu person can also use his own moves in that technique. Also, a striker (JKD) can also mix it up too. So, I don't know what's the right message to take from that, maybe Aikido is still possibe to incorporate into JKD or maybe not.

So far, I feel like I have a good base in JKD in terms of my stance. I know it will definitely be contrary to the Aikido stance, and I guess Aikido and JKD follow different philosophies and approaches. I will think about it a little longer and ask ard.

exile:

Yes, that is one of the intriguing and positive things about MT. I must admit, compared to other forums, MT has a lot more respectful and mature posters. Far less spam and immature bickering than what one can expect from...say maybe a typical bodybuilding forum.

Haha, actually from what I understood, I thought the metabolic drop-off was from age 25. That's what got me worried about my capabilities in taking up MA. But I must admit, that ever since undertaking a cardio and weight-lifting routine in my early 20s, I have been in better shape than I was at 15! I still have a lot to go, actually, as I think my strength in weight-lifting hasn't lived up to my expectations. But I can get your point that if I attack this weak point aggressively, I may not have to feel so rotten about my own body and condition.

It is strange that you mention this, I don't consider myself particularly talented in anything, and thus I wouldn't expect to discover some hidden "talent" in myself when taking up MA. But compared to other activities, like music-making and art perhaps, where a talent or hidden disposition to have a unique gift, i think MA really emphasizes so much on will than talent. I have also come to think that it is important to maintain that "beginner's zest" or hunger, as you put it, because it is so easy to drop out after some time. I have met a few students who have done a little of everything out there, but never stayed in any of the MAs for the long haul.

I would hate to think that after taking up JKD and etc, I drop out after a year or two. I will only regret it when I am around your age! So yes, thanks for reminding me abt the necessity of having will.

 

[whitetiger2001]

First, welcome, and happy posting! :wavey: Have you considered posting a "hello" thread in the Meet & Greet?

Second, Blindside has made some really good points, so I am going to build on that.

1. I am an instructor, and many of my students are friends of mine - but inside the dojang, that does not matter - I am there to push them into performing better, not to be their friend. That said, however, while I do provide both positive and negative feedback, I strive to make sure that it is always constructive - that is, "you need to change this so this will work better" - rather than destructive - that is, "why can't you understand/predict/know things I haven't taught you, you must be an idiot".

2. When I decided I want to start a class of my own, I sat down with my instructor and discussed it with him. He gave me some very good advice, which I try to follow to this day. One thing that he strongly emphasized is that, as the instructor, I have a responsibility to be there every class, and to provide coverage for those rare occasions when I could not be present. I have missed my class 6 times in the last 2 years - and 4 of those times involved extremely bad weather that caused me to cancel class; the other two were for a TKD camp I was an instructor at, and I made sure I had a guest instructor present to run the class. If I am going to be responsible for your learning, I must set the example of being present to teach - illness, travel, family, other responsibilities, etc, notwithstanding - else how can I expect you to show up to learn? If your instructor does not place a premium on his own presence, why should any of his students place a premium on being present? Were I you, I would look into other classes - because if having students were truly important to him, he'd be there for all of you. His other students don't show up consistently because he has set the standard - and the standard is to be inconsistent. This is not fair to you as a student.

3. Can't add much to that one - I know plenty of people who started in their 40s and 50s, and a few in their 60s. 25 is not old.

4. Look around for another school. If this one suited you, you would not be having these concerns. It must suit some of the students, because they keep coming back - but I'd look around for a better fit. If you have a particular style of MA in mind, look around that type of MA - otherwise, I'd suggest looking for a school that has a more consistent schedule. As you look around, talk to the instructor, talk to the students, and see where you feel comfortable - in the long run, comfort is more important for staying with an art than the type of MA - because if you're not comfortable in the class, you won't be likely to stay, no matter how much you like the style, instructor, location, etc.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes!

As a former Instructor myself, I couldn't have said it any better

 

[MA-Caver]

There's a right way and a wrong way to teach people how to do things.
Some people are qualified to teach and some people have the qualifications and aptitude to teach.
When I instruct I make sure my students understand what's going on and WHY it's happening and how it works. If they don't understand I find out what it is and go over it until I find out a way that they will understand and apply what I teach.
Some people can teach and teach very well, but some can teach well and not have the patience to ensure everyone learns on the same curve as they did when they were students.
Hopefully someday your instructor will realize that and be a bit easier on his future students.
The others have given great advice, they've been around for a while so take what you can use and use it. :asian: